From: morganalefay@aol.com (Morgana le Fay)
Date: 08 Sep 1999 11:28:07 EDT
"Mine daughter"
So are you the one I can speak with about your penchant for speaking with authority on histories and people you know nothing about?
You should be ashamed for teaching your daughter false history about my family line and history.
Marius Challenge: Take 2
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From: ianmackenzie@aol.com (Ian MacKenzie)
Date: 08 Sep 1999 11:45:38 EDT
"If you bar someone for protesting against corruption within your
organization, then you are as guilty as the corrupter."
There is a vast world of difference between protesting and outright abuse. If, in my venue, a complaint is brought to my attention, I investigate it. AT NO TIME is this sort of nonsense going to be tolerated when directed AT my staff after -I- have ruled that their actions are appropriate. When I make that determination, I expect that further protest will be directed at -me- rather than at staff members who are trying to do their job.
I fully expect the same standards to be applied -here-.
Ian Rex.
Date: 08 Sep 1999 11:45:38 EDT
"If you bar someone for protesting against corruption within your
organization, then you are as guilty as the corrupter."
There is a vast world of difference between protesting and outright abuse. If, in my venue, a complaint is brought to my attention, I investigate it. AT NO TIME is this sort of nonsense going to be tolerated when directed AT my staff after -I- have ruled that their actions are appropriate. When I make that determination, I expect that further protest will be directed at -me- rather than at staff members who are trying to do their job.
I fully expect the same standards to be applied -here-.
Ian Rex.
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From: leducblanc@aol.com (LeDucBlanc)
Date: 08 Sep 1999 13:57:54 EDT
I find I have to make a simple observation. Neither of the principles in this challenge seem to think they were wronged. Marius seemed perfectly willing to accept the original ruling and understandably but not unacceptably relieved when Golden overruled it. The Baron has kept his discourse with Marius civil, has not expressed any anger or feeling that he was wronged (at least not publicly) to the staff, and both seem
to be keeping the posts they have made on the subject polite and rational.
Several people have made requests that the specific definitions and consequences of the situation be scribed into the rules. Nothing wrong with the suggestion. Indeed, it is a good idea. More, I would think it to be very necessary.
However, it would seem to me that the same group of people as usual seem to see this issue, as they seem to see any issue, as the perfect excuse to take sides and harp on their personal grudges. They recycle the same past complaints, bring out the same insults and accusations, and target the same people. Then, the people who have old grudges against them take the opposite side and fling mud right back. In general, they behave like kindergarten
children when the teacher leaves the room.
Then a few people make rational, intelligent, well spokenm posts. Maybe they are right, maybe they are wrong, maybe they are just expressing an opinion. It doesn't really matter, because they are jumped by one side who assume they are defending the other side. The people jumping them then, as often as not, add them to their list of grudges the next time an issue arises.
Both sides are equally guilty of simply looking for any oppurtunity to snipe at people they don't like or feel they have something against. Both tend to be equally assured in their self righteousness. Both seem to be equally secure in their ability to make moral judgements on the other. In other words, whatever the merits of their respective stances, both sides equally make fools of themselves.
I would suggest that the best way to satisfy these old grudges is to all go somewhere private and kill each other. That would certainly be more effecient than hurling mud. It would also be less of a bother to those of us who might actually be interested in the issue and not the mudslinging.
Percy
Date: 08 Sep 1999 13:57:54 EDT
I find I have to make a simple observation. Neither of the principles in this challenge seem to think they were wronged. Marius seemed perfectly willing to accept the original ruling and understandably but not unacceptably relieved when Golden overruled it. The Baron has kept his discourse with Marius civil, has not expressed any anger or feeling that he was wronged (at least not publicly) to the staff, and both seem
to be keeping the posts they have made on the subject polite and rational.
Several people have made requests that the specific definitions and consequences of the situation be scribed into the rules. Nothing wrong with the suggestion. Indeed, it is a good idea. More, I would think it to be very necessary.
However, it would seem to me that the same group of people as usual seem to see this issue, as they seem to see any issue, as the perfect excuse to take sides and harp on their personal grudges. They recycle the same past complaints, bring out the same insults and accusations, and target the same people. Then, the people who have old grudges against them take the opposite side and fling mud right back. In general, they behave like kindergarten
children when the teacher leaves the room.
Then a few people make rational, intelligent, well spokenm posts. Maybe they are right, maybe they are wrong, maybe they are just expressing an opinion. It doesn't really matter, because they are jumped by one side who assume they are defending the other side. The people jumping them then, as often as not, add them to their list of grudges the next time an issue arises.
Both sides are equally guilty of simply looking for any oppurtunity to snipe at people they don't like or feel they have something against. Both tend to be equally assured in their self righteousness. Both seem to be equally secure in their ability to make moral judgements on the other. In other words, whatever the merits of their respective stances, both sides equally make fools of themselves.
I would suggest that the best way to satisfy these old grudges is to all go somewhere private and kill each other. That would certainly be more effecient than hurling mud. It would also be less of a bother to those of us who might actually be interested in the issue and not the mudslinging.
Percy
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From: zafiroo@aol.com (Zafiroo)
Date: 08 Sep 1999 18:36:01 EDT
::Shakes his head at messages on the cork and laughs:;
Jona,
You really havent said anything that required wit to awnser.Your own missives say enough about your intellegance or lack of.
If standing for one I consider a friend is thought of as being spineless, then so be it.
As for wheather you think I am honorable or not I could careless you have shown nothing but hatered and arrogance on these walls.With each of your attacks and slander towards the patrons of DoS you have brought down the honor and forthrightnes in your own eyes.For me I see many honorable people in the arena from commoner to overlord to Officials.I see only a few with lack of honor and you are close to the top of that list only to be beat out by
Methous and it is a close second you are running.
Zafiroo Turidan
Baron of the First
Date: 08 Sep 1999 18:36:01 EDT
::Shakes his head at messages on the cork and laughs:;
Jona,
You really havent said anything that required wit to awnser.Your own missives say enough about your intellegance or lack of.
If standing for one I consider a friend is thought of as being spineless, then so be it.
As for wheather you think I am honorable or not I could careless you have shown nothing but hatered and arrogance on these walls.With each of your attacks and slander towards the patrons of DoS you have brought down the honor and forthrightnes in your own eyes.For me I see many honorable people in the arena from commoner to overlord to Officials.I see only a few with lack of honor and you are close to the top of that list only to be beat out by
Methous and it is a close second you are running.
Zafiroo Turidan
Baron of the First
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From: zafiroo@aol.com (Zafiroo)
Date: 08 Sep 1999 18:47:35 EDT
Morgan,
I said what I meant and meant what I said.It is not irrelevent in the way I said it and thats the way I meant it.
Zafiroo Turidan
Baron of the First
Date: 08 Sep 1999 18:47:35 EDT
Morgan,
I said what I meant and meant what I said.It is not irrelevent in the way I said it and thats the way I meant it.
Zafiroo Turidan
Baron of the First
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From: morganalefay@aol.com (Morgana le Fay)
Date: 08 Sep 1999 19:20:49 EDT
Zaf: " I said what I meant and meant what I said.It is not irrelevent in the way I said it and thats the way I meant it."
Not that I do not appreciate a nice non sequitur diversion, but...
Let me know when you figure out what relevance means. Perhaps then you and I could have a real discussion.
Good day.
Date: 08 Sep 1999 19:20:49 EDT
Zaf: " I said what I meant and meant what I said.It is not irrelevent in the way I said it and thats the way I meant it."
Not that I do not appreciate a nice non sequitur diversion, but...
Let me know when you figure out what relevance means. Perhaps then you and I could have a real discussion.
Good day.
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From: jonalyn@aol.com (Jonalyn)
Date: 08 Sep 1999 20:40:51 EDT
The commoner peruses the Baron's missive, chortling softly as she re-reads it, finally deciphering certain portions.
Baron Turidan
Thee hae presented nae annathin' save babble, an' yuir own missive certes speaks mos' adroitly 'o yuir grasp 'o circumstances, to whit, verra little grasp atall. Tis 'ighly amusin' that thee wh' know verra little 'o either mineself or th' duels, wouldst deign t' fall back upon th' usual boring comment, to whit, "...you have shown nothing but hatered (sic) and arrogance on these walls." Perchance thou art nae cognizant 'o th' difference betwixt
hatred, arrogance, an' bringin' t' light a matter th' required questionin'.
Certes thou art free t' opine th' thee see manna honorable people in th' basement, yet certes, Master Turidan, considerin' thee hae nae way 'o truly knowin' mos' 'o those wh' truly 'eld 'onor in 'igh regard an' strove t' instill such by their verra demeanor, tis nae surprise th' thine standard wh' which t' measure 'onor, ist much lower th' mine own. Tis seemin' thee art among those wh' 'old th' sayin' "Oops, excuse me, I made a mistake.",
repeatedly, shouldst nae be 'eld accountable fer makin' 'em. Amusin' an' simple, certes. Much ast thou art.
Ast certes thou dinna know me, Baron Zafiroo Turidan, well enou t' call me by mine diminutive, "Jona", thou ast certes nae know me well enow ta attribute unta me either hatred or arrogance, Baron. Ast Morgana hae penned, Baron, perhaps thou wouldst find someone t' explain unta thee th' meanin' 'o relevance. Indeed, perhaps, thee hae nae need t' understand, for tis bu' seemin' only th' verra simplest 'o concepts seem t' penetrate thine skull.
Percival,
How droll, thou art back t' soundin' like th' teacher 'o kinder agin. Tis seemin' thine discourse ast usual be little more th' thine usual diatribe. Tis 'ighly amusin', that thee wh' do claim such worldly experiences, do speak 'o mud slingin' repeatedly. Och, certes, nae let us fergit, tis thee champion deceit, deception, lies an' floutin' 'o th' verra foundation 'o th' sport ast mere mistakes. Tis thou art th' buffoon, Percival. Tis indeed
thine observation be 'simple", tis expected 'o thee th' t'would be. Tis t' attribute t' others wh' thou art thineself doin' an' nae realize thou art makin' a moral judgement, merely confirms thine simple mind.
Again thee spout th' 'might makes right' theory, Percival. Tis oft th' which those wh' canna deal in rational converse do rely upon. Run along, Percy, tis certes someone thou canst beat or threaten or slay, t' satisfy thine observation th' folk shouldst settle matters by violence.
Jonalyn Starfare
Date: 08 Sep 1999 20:40:51 EDT
The commoner peruses the Baron's missive, chortling softly as she re-reads it, finally deciphering certain portions.
Baron Turidan
Thee hae presented nae annathin' save babble, an' yuir own missive certes speaks mos' adroitly 'o yuir grasp 'o circumstances, to whit, verra little grasp atall. Tis 'ighly amusin' that thee wh' know verra little 'o either mineself or th' duels, wouldst deign t' fall back upon th' usual boring comment, to whit, "...you have shown nothing but hatered (sic) and arrogance on these walls." Perchance thou art nae cognizant 'o th' difference betwixt
hatred, arrogance, an' bringin' t' light a matter th' required questionin'.
Certes thou art free t' opine th' thee see manna honorable people in th' basement, yet certes, Master Turidan, considerin' thee hae nae way 'o truly knowin' mos' 'o those wh' truly 'eld 'onor in 'igh regard an' strove t' instill such by their verra demeanor, tis nae surprise th' thine standard wh' which t' measure 'onor, ist much lower th' mine own. Tis seemin' thee art among those wh' 'old th' sayin' "Oops, excuse me, I made a mistake.",
repeatedly, shouldst nae be 'eld accountable fer makin' 'em. Amusin' an' simple, certes. Much ast thou art.
Ast certes thou dinna know me, Baron Zafiroo Turidan, well enou t' call me by mine diminutive, "Jona", thou ast certes nae know me well enow ta attribute unta me either hatred or arrogance, Baron. Ast Morgana hae penned, Baron, perhaps thou wouldst find someone t' explain unta thee th' meanin' 'o relevance. Indeed, perhaps, thee hae nae need t' understand, for tis bu' seemin' only th' verra simplest 'o concepts seem t' penetrate thine skull.
Percival,
How droll, thou art back t' soundin' like th' teacher 'o kinder agin. Tis seemin' thine discourse ast usual be little more th' thine usual diatribe. Tis 'ighly amusin', that thee wh' do claim such worldly experiences, do speak 'o mud slingin' repeatedly. Och, certes, nae let us fergit, tis thee champion deceit, deception, lies an' floutin' 'o th' verra foundation 'o th' sport ast mere mistakes. Tis thou art th' buffoon, Percival. Tis indeed
thine observation be 'simple", tis expected 'o thee th' t'would be. Tis t' attribute t' others wh' thou art thineself doin' an' nae realize thou art makin' a moral judgement, merely confirms thine simple mind.
Again thee spout th' 'might makes right' theory, Percival. Tis oft th' which those wh' canna deal in rational converse do rely upon. Run along, Percy, tis certes someone thou canst beat or threaten or slay, t' satisfy thine observation th' folk shouldst settle matters by violence.
Jonalyn Starfare
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From: jessetroyn@aol.com (JesseTroyn)
Date: 08 Sep 1999 20:56:26 EDT
::busts out laughing as he reads Zafiroo's post, glancing at Jona and taking a drag off his cig:: You got any idea what in the world he's saying? Hell, you think he's even got any idea what he's saying? Man.. I think my IQ just dropped a few points from reading that... ::winks and heads off, humming under his breath::
Date: 08 Sep 1999 20:56:26 EDT
::busts out laughing as he reads Zafiroo's post, glancing at Jona and taking a drag off his cig:: You got any idea what in the world he's saying? Hell, you think he's even got any idea what he's saying? Man.. I think my IQ just dropped a few points from reading that... ::winks and heads off, humming under his breath::
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From: mariusix@aol.com (Marius IX)
Date: 08 Sep 1999 21:24:19 EDT
Jonalyn,
This is not a matter of insecurity, or of my having a respect for your opinion, so much as it is a personal affront to my dignity. Of course you can think what you wish, it is your perogative to do so. And if I mistook your inaffiblity as being more playful than malignant, I suppose it is more my fault than yours.
That being said, I bear not a shadow of respect for you, or your opinions. I apologize for dragging this out, and for further dragging this challenge through the mud, but the slander with which you insulted Drakewyn, Goldendust, the honorable Baron Zafiroo, and Myself is not something I can stand for. Regardless, this ends here.
Now I am sure that you will post some bitter, condescending response to this post in your trademark broken English, and when you do I will not bother to read it. These are my final words on this topic. Marius locuta est; causa finita est*.
* Marius has spoken, it is over.
Gaius Marius Colestae'
Magnus Centurion of Imperial Rome.
Commander of Legions at Lugdunum, Carthago, Capua, & Ravenna.
Warlord of the DoS.
Civus Romanus.
Date: 08 Sep 1999 21:24:19 EDT
Jonalyn,
This is not a matter of insecurity, or of my having a respect for your opinion, so much as it is a personal affront to my dignity. Of course you can think what you wish, it is your perogative to do so. And if I mistook your inaffiblity as being more playful than malignant, I suppose it is more my fault than yours.
That being said, I bear not a shadow of respect for you, or your opinions. I apologize for dragging this out, and for further dragging this challenge through the mud, but the slander with which you insulted Drakewyn, Goldendust, the honorable Baron Zafiroo, and Myself is not something I can stand for. Regardless, this ends here.
Now I am sure that you will post some bitter, condescending response to this post in your trademark broken English, and when you do I will not bother to read it. These are my final words on this topic. Marius locuta est; causa finita est*.
* Marius has spoken, it is over.
Gaius Marius Colestae'
Magnus Centurion of Imperial Rome.
Commander of Legions at Lugdunum, Carthago, Capua, & Ravenna.
Warlord of the DoS.
Civus Romanus.
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From: cletus669@aol.com (Cletus669)
Date: 08 Sep 1999 21:40:29 EDT
Zaf,
Maybe you should fully grasp the English language before you proceed to use it to express all those witty ideas you hold in your head...
With that in mind, I offer some help:
Relevant:
Adj: having significant and demonstrable bearing on the matter at hand.
Keep it coming Baron, you never cease to amuse me.
Cletus
Date: 08 Sep 1999 21:40:29 EDT
Zaf,
Maybe you should fully grasp the English language before you proceed to use it to express all those witty ideas you hold in your head...
With that in mind, I offer some help:
Relevant:
Adj: having significant and demonstrable bearing on the matter at hand.
Keep it coming Baron, you never cease to amuse me.
Cletus
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From: jonalyn@aol.com (Jonalyn)
Date: 08 Sep 1999 22:17:34 EDT
She slides a sidelong wink at Jesse, chortling, "Och, Ah lifted one 'o G's translators an' reprogrammed t' chip. Dinna tell G, 'e'll bill me fer it an' want a piece 'o th' profits from t' franchise."
Date: 08 Sep 1999 22:17:34 EDT
She slides a sidelong wink at Jesse, chortling, "Och, Ah lifted one 'o G's translators an' reprogrammed t' chip. Dinna tell G, 'e'll bill me fer it an' want a piece 'o th' profits from t' franchise."
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From: jonalyn@aol.com (Jonalyn)
Date: 08 Sep 1999 22:40:27 EDT
Laughing softly she tacks a note to the cork.
Marius,
Thou presumes thee hae anna dignity t' affront. If thee be th' personification 'o dignity, tis certes th' standard hae been lowered e'en further. Tis thine grasp 'o th' ancient tongue certes be unfailingly tenuous, much ast thine grasp 'o th' circumstances. Tis well thee hae taken th' better part 'o valor an' hae chosen t' retreat, lest thine self proclaimed dignity suffer further.
Tis amusing that thee wouldst deign t' apprise me 'o thine lack 'o respect, laddie buck. Thee displayed th' mos' amusingly t'other eve in th' duelin' 'ouse, neh? Tis e'en more amusin' th' thee wouldst include thineself in th' list 'o those thee term ast 'onorable personages. Since thou hae stated thee shall nae bother t' peruse mine comments, they mos' assuredly shall nae prick thine withering dignity atall.
Amusedly,
Jonalyn Starfare
Date: 08 Sep 1999 22:40:27 EDT
Laughing softly she tacks a note to the cork.
Marius,
Thou presumes thee hae anna dignity t' affront. If thee be th' personification 'o dignity, tis certes th' standard hae been lowered e'en further. Tis thine grasp 'o th' ancient tongue certes be unfailingly tenuous, much ast thine grasp 'o th' circumstances. Tis well thee hae taken th' better part 'o valor an' hae chosen t' retreat, lest thine self proclaimed dignity suffer further.
Tis amusing that thee wouldst deign t' apprise me 'o thine lack 'o respect, laddie buck. Thee displayed th' mos' amusingly t'other eve in th' duelin' 'ouse, neh? Tis e'en more amusin' th' thee wouldst include thineself in th' list 'o those thee term ast 'onorable personages. Since thou hae stated thee shall nae bother t' peruse mine comments, they mos' assuredly shall nae prick thine withering dignity atall.
Amusedly,
Jonalyn Starfare