From: leducblanc@aol.com (LeDucBlanc)
Date: 07 Jun 2000 19:21:33 EDT
Though some of the content of this post is a little late, I feel the best place for all of it is in one comprehensive statement to all hang together. After all, these opinions are all interconnected in recent statements and posts made by more than just one or two people. Yes, I have admitted biases in favor of both Avery and Daelin, however that does not change the fact that I believe I have formulated by opinions as
objectively and logically as possible. I try to consider everything carefully, and I try to explain my ideas carefully. So, here we go.
1.) The matter of the extension: I happen to not only think that Val was in his rights, I happen to think he did the right thing. I did not at first, but after serious consideration I do. We have Val's word and Drey's word that he did inform at least Val that he would be unable to make the duel. For those of us who do not trust Val's word, though I do think that a deliberate slur on the honesty of our highest ranking official is somewhat pathetic,
we have the fact that he also made a similar statement in Twilight Island to the staff there. This would tend to make it more likely that Val and Drey are telling the truth, not less. Since I believe Val is telling the truth, I understand that Avery made an attempt to inform individuals that there would be (at the least) some kind of delay. I believe that his effort to inform the officials of the sport about said delay fully justifies some
consideration of his problems on their part.
2.) The decision to finally declare a forfeit: I believe that this decision, at the time Val made it, was also a correct decision. Why do I say the forfeit was as right as the original extensions were? Simply put, the situation changed. It was no longer simply a matter of an Overlord challenge taking longer than was expected. The Overlord was nowhere to be found, his challenger was under challenge, and the Warlord Tourney (one of whose
winners would have the right to challenge an Overlord) was rapidly approaching. This made it quite necessary to resolve the situation quickly and as fairly as possible to all sides. I think that if the forfeit had come sooner it would have been precipitous, but coming when it did it was entirely appropriate. Frankly, I believe that the way Val handled both the extension and the forfeit show stronger leadership than his father ever showed in the
office of supervisor. My opinion of him in general has risen several brackets.
3.) The Council's final decision: Here I do not agree quite so much as I did with Val. I believe that Drey should have fought a champion for the crown. I realize that his cause for challenge was specifically against Avery, but I feel that the final decision reached left his challenge unresolved. I don't think that a challenge should be left unresolved and I don't like the fact that no statement was made about Drey's right to challenge for the cycle.
I realize that the cycle was practically over, but that is the sort of legal nit that the Council is supposed to pick. After all, the fate of the crown was not their sole responsibility. They were also supposed to address the fate of Drey's challenge for it. I think some individuals might have had selfish motives in the decision reached, and I think that the proposal that only present Councilmembers be included in the Tourney showed either bad
motives or bad judgement in its proposers and backers. I understand that a Tourney of Barons has been the traditional solution for an empty throne, but the circumstances here were different than past vacancies.
4.) The Tourney itself: I believe that this event was somewhat mismanaged by the staff. I don't believe this was at all deliberate, but it happened all the same. With only five contestants, I believe that one of two things should have been done. The first solution would have been to allow (with preference in order of ranking) the top ten Warlords to participate as willing, until there were 10 or more contestants in the Tourney. The second solution
would have been to make the Tourney a match tournament rather than a round robin. Each Baron could have faced every other Baron in a best of three or best of five match. I realize that this would have taken longer, but I believe it would have been preferable to the method chosen. Something like the crown of the Overlord should not be disposed of as quickly as possible.
5.) Daelin as Overlord: I am glad Daelin won, frankly. Of the other three members of the Council that I thought would have made fit Overlords, two did not participate. The third, Sartan, made a very strong showing in the Tourney but did not have Daelin's touch throughout. Daelin is a man of integrity, intelligence, deep loyalty (despite slurs by individuals who barely know him), and a real regard for the integrity of the sport. While I do not agree
with all his decisions, I believe that he makes them all for the right reasons. I find individuals' remarks questioning his motives and honor rather ignorant. I also know that he has the skill to defend the crown well. He will do the position of Overlord and the sport we partake in nothing but honor while he holds the title.
6.) Daelin's match with Taylara: Frankly, I am all behind Daelin. Despite claims that he has 'forsaken' loyalty and that Taylara has not, I would rank Daelin far above Tayalara in that department. He was a staunchly loyal member of House Rising through its short lifespan, and an equally staunch member of House Dragoon-Talandor. He has strongly supported his friends, even sometimes when he disagreed with them privately, and he has always been there
when they needed him. Taylara was pivotally involved in the period of intrahouse quarreling and backbiting that so badly damaged HDT, and her public statements about fellow members of a House intended to be 'a group of friends dueling as a family' are not my definition of loyalty at all. Perhaps her emotions got the best of her, perhaps she made a mistake, perhaps she was more heated than she intended. I happen to like and respect Tay, but statements
made comparing her loyalty and Dae's can be firmly refuted by the facts.
7.) Overlord Intercession vs. the Test of Worthiness: These are, in my mind, so close to being exactly the same thing that th only difference is one of semantics. The Overlord Intercession is a demonstration that the Overlord reciprocates the Loyalty his Barons give him. The Test of Worthiness is a chance for those who support the Overlord to show him their Loyalty. Both might sometimes be political necessities, but both degrade the idea of
sportsmanship that any competition is based on. In a sport, athletes compete to discover who is the best. A champion defends his title against his challengers. The primary reason to hold any sort of championship or title in any sport is (or should be) to defend it. To allow another to defend it for you undermines the sport and sportsmanship in general. The fact that the Overlord is the 'Supreme Duelist' of the sport makes it more important that he
defend his title himself, not less. After all, the supreme champion of a sport should not need anyone to fight his battles for him. The main difference in these situations is where the onus of the blow against sportsmanship lies. In the case of the Intercession, the onus lies on the Baron who makes the request. An Overlord who intercedes is supporting his supporters as he would want them to support him. It is the Baron who is refusing to fight his
own battle. In the case of the Test, it is the Overlord who is abrogating his responsibility to defend his own title. The Baron doing the Testing is fulfilling his commitment to support the Overlord. The sin is not the willingness, in either case, to support a friend or ally. The sin is in not facing one's challenges one's self.
7.) The intervention of another in either the Intercession or the Test: I believe that such an action is a tremendous move in support of sportsmanship. By attempting to block an Intercession or a Test, the individual intervening is attempting to force the title holder to do the right thing and defend the title that is his responsibility. While, yes, there are people who probably should be tested, the honor of the decision to attempt to force a title
holder to do the responsible and sporting thing should not be questioned. Again, the main reason for holding a title is (or should be) defending it successfuly.
Some of these statements are new and some are old. All are what I believe and I have consistently stood for my beliefs. I will continue to do so.
Duc Percival Marchand de Clermont
Warlord of the Duel of Swords
The White Duke
General Statement of Views
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From: xxlucianxx@aol.com (XxLucianxX)
Date: 07 Jun 2000 19:34:34 EDT
So, why should the Supreme Duelist waste his time fighting any imbecile who can gain 15 peer wins in their career? They should have to defeat his champion to prove that they are a top contender worthy of the Overlord's time. Also, the Overlord is not simply the best duelist, he is a political leader. As such, why would he risk letting some incompetent Warlord gain such a high position to a single match? What if he
has a cold? One lucky blow is all it takes to win a match. These are simply my attempts to further understand your opinions..
-- Lucian
Date: 07 Jun 2000 19:34:34 EDT
So, why should the Supreme Duelist waste his time fighting any imbecile who can gain 15 peer wins in their career? They should have to defeat his champion to prove that they are a top contender worthy of the Overlord's time. Also, the Overlord is not simply the best duelist, he is a political leader. As such, why would he risk letting some incompetent Warlord gain such a high position to a single match? What if he
has a cold? One lucky blow is all it takes to win a match. These are simply my attempts to further understand your opinions..
-- Lucian
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From: casmaxim@aol.com (Cas Maxim)
Date: 07 Jun 2000 20:03:19 EDT
I knew there was a reason I like Lucian.
Cassius Gaius Maximius
Baron of the 12th
Date: 07 Jun 2000 20:03:19 EDT
I knew there was a reason I like Lucian.
Cassius Gaius Maximius
Baron of the 12th
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From: leducblanc@aol.com (LeDucBlanc)
Date: 07 Jun 2000 20:31:08 EDT
> As such, why would he risk letting some incompetent Warlord gain such a high
>position to a single match?
I never said it should be a single match. Frankly, I would love to see a rules change making it impossible for a challenger to refuse the best of three.
As for why he should fight anyone who challenges, that is simple. He is supposed to be the Supreme Duelist. That requires proving it. To be the champion, one needs to defend his title. In my opinion there should be pride in defending that title, no matter who is the challenger. It should never be a matter of the Overlord feeling like a defense of his title is waste. The defense of is title is the reason (or should be the reason) that he
holds it in the first place.
Duc Percival Marchand de Clermont
Warlord of the Duel of Swords
The White Duke
Date: 07 Jun 2000 20:31:08 EDT
> As such, why would he risk letting some incompetent Warlord gain such a high
>position to a single match?
I never said it should be a single match. Frankly, I would love to see a rules change making it impossible for a challenger to refuse the best of three.
As for why he should fight anyone who challenges, that is simple. He is supposed to be the Supreme Duelist. That requires proving it. To be the champion, one needs to defend his title. In my opinion there should be pride in defending that title, no matter who is the challenger. It should never be a matter of the Overlord feeling like a defense of his title is waste. The defense of is title is the reason (or should be the reason) that he
holds it in the first place.
Duc Percival Marchand de Clermont
Warlord of the Duel of Swords
The White Duke
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From: jonalyn@aol.com (Jonalyn)
Date: 07 Jun 2000 22:35:26 EDT
Percy,
I must say for one who states his intent to be logical and objective, thee seem to misrepresent mere conjecture ast fact, Percy, rather a well documented penchant of yuirs. Perhaps thee were unaware that Master Valentine Evermeadow, upon being queried, didst state that Avery Shiv Blade hae nae in fact requested anna extension. Therefore I shall presume thee be taking the word of Master Starke in that regard.
With respect to thine opinion ast to the Council's final decision, I shouldst verra much wish to ascertain the logic behind thine statement that the Coucil dinna address the matter of Master Starke's challenge. They deposed the Overlord and requested a Tourney of Barons to decide the matter, thereby rather deftly resolving Master Starke's challenge by rendering said challenge moot. Anna further statement by said Council with respect to the right of
challenge held by Master Starke wouldst seem to be outside the purview of the Council.
With respect to your comments with regard to the Tourney of Barons, Percy, the Tourney was requested by the Barons, approved, arranged and officiated by none other than Master Valentine Evermeadow himself. Ast to the inclusion of anna warlords in such a tourney, be thee reminded that those warlords what hae a yen to garner the mantle hae the option of entering the Warlord Tourney ast well ast the option of placing the gauntlet at the feet of anna
Baron as a stepping stone to the mantle, ast well ast to lay the gauntlet of challenge at the feet of the Overlord.
I must say this ast well, Percy, considering yuir penchant for supporting much less than honorable deeds over the course of time, nae the least of which wast your strident support for the perfidious and deceitful wench, Jaycynda Ashleana whilst just ast stridently casting insult upon the Lady of Avalon, Morgana le Fay ast well ast mineself, among others, e'en to calling the Lady of Avalon's honor onto question, ast well ast your castigations and
constant insults unto Lord Dalamar Ar'Daumon, thee shall certes understand mine contempt for thee when thee do make comment with regard to any individual who may question Daelin Dragonsblade's motive, integrity, honesty or his honor.
Ast to having anna regard for the sport, Percy, thee long agon displayed precisely what regard thee had for it. Cheating, lying, special privilege, unsportsmanlike conduct, all hae thee held to be justified, Percy, and woe unto those that chose to bring to light such dark and despicable deeds, neh?
Tis mine sincerest hope, Percy, that if Daelin, be a man of integrity, intelligence and deep loyalty and ast well hast a true regard for this sport, hast nae learned those things from thee.
I am always amused when thee do make claim to refute anna statement with yuir so called 'facts" Percy, since thee hae long displayed a rather adoit inability to actually relate facts.
O'ertime, Percy, when one takes into consideration what thee consider to be sportsmanlike conduct, suffice it to say, tis mine sincerest hope that neither those who partake in this ancient bloodsport nor those what be new come to the basement, subscribe to your concept of sportsmanship.
Bluntly,
Jonalyn Starfare
Date: 07 Jun 2000 22:35:26 EDT
Percy,
I must say for one who states his intent to be logical and objective, thee seem to misrepresent mere conjecture ast fact, Percy, rather a well documented penchant of yuirs. Perhaps thee were unaware that Master Valentine Evermeadow, upon being queried, didst state that Avery Shiv Blade hae nae in fact requested anna extension. Therefore I shall presume thee be taking the word of Master Starke in that regard.
With respect to thine opinion ast to the Council's final decision, I shouldst verra much wish to ascertain the logic behind thine statement that the Coucil dinna address the matter of Master Starke's challenge. They deposed the Overlord and requested a Tourney of Barons to decide the matter, thereby rather deftly resolving Master Starke's challenge by rendering said challenge moot. Anna further statement by said Council with respect to the right of
challenge held by Master Starke wouldst seem to be outside the purview of the Council.
With respect to your comments with regard to the Tourney of Barons, Percy, the Tourney was requested by the Barons, approved, arranged and officiated by none other than Master Valentine Evermeadow himself. Ast to the inclusion of anna warlords in such a tourney, be thee reminded that those warlords what hae a yen to garner the mantle hae the option of entering the Warlord Tourney ast well ast the option of placing the gauntlet at the feet of anna
Baron as a stepping stone to the mantle, ast well ast to lay the gauntlet of challenge at the feet of the Overlord.
I must say this ast well, Percy, considering yuir penchant for supporting much less than honorable deeds over the course of time, nae the least of which wast your strident support for the perfidious and deceitful wench, Jaycynda Ashleana whilst just ast stridently casting insult upon the Lady of Avalon, Morgana le Fay ast well ast mineself, among others, e'en to calling the Lady of Avalon's honor onto question, ast well ast your castigations and
constant insults unto Lord Dalamar Ar'Daumon, thee shall certes understand mine contempt for thee when thee do make comment with regard to any individual who may question Daelin Dragonsblade's motive, integrity, honesty or his honor.
Ast to having anna regard for the sport, Percy, thee long agon displayed precisely what regard thee had for it. Cheating, lying, special privilege, unsportsmanlike conduct, all hae thee held to be justified, Percy, and woe unto those that chose to bring to light such dark and despicable deeds, neh?
Tis mine sincerest hope, Percy, that if Daelin, be a man of integrity, intelligence and deep loyalty and ast well hast a true regard for this sport, hast nae learned those things from thee.
I am always amused when thee do make claim to refute anna statement with yuir so called 'facts" Percy, since thee hae long displayed a rather adoit inability to actually relate facts.
O'ertime, Percy, when one takes into consideration what thee consider to be sportsmanlike conduct, suffice it to say, tis mine sincerest hope that neither those who partake in this ancient bloodsport nor those what be new come to the basement, subscribe to your concept of sportsmanship.
Bluntly,
Jonalyn Starfare
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From: drakewyni@aol.com (Drakewyn I)
Date: 08 Jun 2000 03:47:52 EDT
Simply put...
Anyone who disparages Jonalyn Starfare is merely fighting fire with fire.
And all that does is increase the size of the flames.
Lady Drake, aka the Gryphon.
Date: 08 Jun 2000 03:47:52 EDT
Simply put...
Anyone who disparages Jonalyn Starfare is merely fighting fire with fire.
And all that does is increase the size of the flames.
Lady Drake, aka the Gryphon.
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From: jonalyn@aol.com (Jonalyn)
Date: 08 Jun 2000 19:19:45 EDT
Drakey Poo,
Shall we then be graced with nae hearing nor having to peruse anna further disparaging remarks from thee?
Amusedly,
Jonalyn Starfare
Date: 08 Jun 2000 19:19:45 EDT
Drakey Poo,
Shall we then be graced with nae hearing nor having to peruse anna further disparaging remarks from thee?
Amusedly,
Jonalyn Starfare
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From: drakewyni@aol.com (Drakewyn I)
Date: 09 Jun 2000 22:59:56 EDT
Jony-poo.
Some like it hot, and all your fire is merely blustery hot wind.
Lady Drake, aka the Gryphon.
Date: 09 Jun 2000 22:59:56 EDT
Jony-poo.
Some like it hot, and all your fire is merely blustery hot wind.
Lady Drake, aka the Gryphon.
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From: jonalyn@aol.com (Jonalyn)
Date: 10 Jun 2000 02:33:06 EDT
Drakey Poo,
Considerin' yuir penchant fer 'ot air an' nae bein' able ta stand ta 'eat, tis more th' amusin' th' ye wouldst make such a comment, nae ta mention yuir continual whinin' bu' speaks 'o yuir ongoin' desperation.
Tis plain, Drakey Poo, yuir goddess mus' hae a sense 'o 'umor, after all. One needs bu' look upon thee ta realize jus' wh' a droll sense 'o 'umor th' be.
Jonalyn Starfare
Date: 10 Jun 2000 02:33:06 EDT
Drakey Poo,
Considerin' yuir penchant fer 'ot air an' nae bein' able ta stand ta 'eat, tis more th' amusin' th' ye wouldst make such a comment, nae ta mention yuir continual whinin' bu' speaks 'o yuir ongoin' desperation.
Tis plain, Drakey Poo, yuir goddess mus' hae a sense 'o 'umor, after all. One needs bu' look upon thee ta realize jus' wh' a droll sense 'o 'umor th' be.
Jonalyn Starfare
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From: novagreys@aol.com (Nova GreyS)
Date: 10 Jun 2000 11:10:08 EDT
Ladies (and I use this term loosely, "Drakey" and "Jony"),
Take it outside, will you? I'm tired of hearing all the hissing but seeing no claws. Jello ring, Sunday, Sunday, Sunday, main event. Let's see some blood to match the acid. I'll be happy to find a few opening acts and we can make an event of it.
After all, the acid's getting old and stale. At least come up with new pet names for each other. Here, I'll give a few suggestions:
"Raving, lunatic witch"
"Backbiting old hag"
"Slack-jawed misanthrope"
"Unwashed servant girl"
Use your imaginations. Variety is the spice of life.
Yeah, I know. "She's all talk", "I refuse to raise my weapon against someone like her", blah, blah, blah. How about for charity? My kid needs new shoes.
J::this symbol drawn in masterfully::
~Nova Grey Shadow
Date: 10 Jun 2000 11:10:08 EDT
Ladies (and I use this term loosely, "Drakey" and "Jony"),
Take it outside, will you? I'm tired of hearing all the hissing but seeing no claws. Jello ring, Sunday, Sunday, Sunday, main event. Let's see some blood to match the acid. I'll be happy to find a few opening acts and we can make an event of it.
After all, the acid's getting old and stale. At least come up with new pet names for each other. Here, I'll give a few suggestions:
"Raving, lunatic witch"
"Backbiting old hag"
"Slack-jawed misanthrope"
"Unwashed servant girl"
Use your imaginations. Variety is the spice of life.
Yeah, I know. "She's all talk", "I refuse to raise my weapon against someone like her", blah, blah, blah. How about for charity? My kid needs new shoes.
J::this symbol drawn in masterfully::
~Nova Grey Shadow
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From: jonalyn@aol.com (Jonalyn)
Date: 11 Jun 2000 03:08:08 EDT
Nova,
Thank ye kindly fer ta suggestions. Ah wast thinkin' more 'long ta lines 'o bawdy, bat fowlin' baggage, dronin, flap mouthed foot licker, er mewlin', ill-nurtured 'arpy. Be th' ta spice ye be seekin'?
Ast ta bein' a lady, Nova, ne'er hae made anna such claim', though Drakey Poo makes it a point ta include th' wi' 'er signature.
Ast ta drawin' blade agin Drakey Poo, Nova, ta clay brained wench eschewed ta chance ta match blades a wee while back by 'er own choice, mind ye.
Jonalyn Starfare
Date: 11 Jun 2000 03:08:08 EDT
Nova,
Thank ye kindly fer ta suggestions. Ah wast thinkin' more 'long ta lines 'o bawdy, bat fowlin' baggage, dronin, flap mouthed foot licker, er mewlin', ill-nurtured 'arpy. Be th' ta spice ye be seekin'?
Ast ta bein' a lady, Nova, ne'er hae made anna such claim', though Drakey Poo makes it a point ta include th' wi' 'er signature.
Ast ta drawin' blade agin Drakey Poo, Nova, ta clay brained wench eschewed ta chance ta match blades a wee while back by 'er own choice, mind ye.
Jonalyn Starfare
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From: drakewyni@aol.com (Drakewyn I)
Date: 11 Jun 2000 05:45:25 EDT
Thank you Nova, for your suggestion.
Starfare.
Blade to blade, assuming you can actually lift one. Skill alone, no magicks but the Ward itself.
There is a challenge match tonight, dare you face me when it is completed?
Lady Drake, aka the Gryphon.
Date: 11 Jun 2000 05:45:25 EDT
Thank you Nova, for your suggestion.
Starfare.
Blade to blade, assuming you can actually lift one. Skill alone, no magicks but the Ward itself.
There is a challenge match tonight, dare you face me when it is completed?
Lady Drake, aka the Gryphon.
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From: dreystarke@aol.com (DreyStarke)
Date: 11 Jun 2000 13:06:58 EDT
Why do you have to have a Ward? I don't care. Kill her.
It's no use with a ward; nothing to risk. This fight is going to prove absolutely nothing.
- Drey D'erest Sanchez SIZE=5 PTSIZE=16>Starke
Date: 11 Jun 2000 13:06:58 EDT
Why do you have to have a Ward? I don't care. Kill her.
It's no use with a ward; nothing to risk. This fight is going to prove absolutely nothing.
- Drey D'erest Sanchez SIZE=5 PTSIZE=16>Starke
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From: karnafexx@aol.com (Karnafexx)
Date: 15 Jun 2000 11:15:03 EDT
>It's no use with a ward; nothing to risk. This fight is going to prove
>absolutely nothing.
This may sound strange coming from me but how will a fight solve anything anyway? In DoS, Drake is more accomplished than Jona, In TDL Jona is better than Drake. What will one match solve? Ward or no ward?
Drey, you could somehow manage a win against me someday, that sure as hell wouldn't mean you're as good as me even when I'm out of dueling. For someone who isn't that skilled in the brutal sciences, you sure like to offer up violence as a solution.
I'd be more than happy to meet you and a few of your friends out back in the alley if you need furhter enlightenment on this.
BRK
Date: 15 Jun 2000 11:15:03 EDT
>It's no use with a ward; nothing to risk. This fight is going to prove
>absolutely nothing.
This may sound strange coming from me but how will a fight solve anything anyway? In DoS, Drake is more accomplished than Jona, In TDL Jona is better than Drake. What will one match solve? Ward or no ward?
Drey, you could somehow manage a win against me someday, that sure as hell wouldn't mean you're as good as me even when I'm out of dueling. For someone who isn't that skilled in the brutal sciences, you sure like to offer up violence as a solution.
I'd be more than happy to meet you and a few of your friends out back in the alley if you need furhter enlightenment on this.
BRK
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From: dreystarke@aol.com (DreyStarke)
Date: 15 Jun 2000 11:58:59 EDT
>What will one match solve? Ward or no ward?
>
Loser isn't here anymore! Isn't that wonderful?
Sure, I'd have a go against ya without a ward. No problem, Billy Boy.
- Drey D'erest Sanchez SIZE=5 PTSIZE=16>Starke
Date: 15 Jun 2000 11:58:59 EDT
>What will one match solve? Ward or no ward?
>
Loser isn't here anymore! Isn't that wonderful?
Sure, I'd have a go against ya without a ward. No problem, Billy Boy.
- Drey D'erest Sanchez SIZE=5 PTSIZE=16>Starke