From: gnrtdrgoon@aol.com (GnrtDrgoon)
Date: 17 Apr 1999 19:00:27 EDT
>Coron
>
>I dinna give a damn who she is, and her wearing a uniform dinna cut it
>either. The officials of this sport hae shown a distinct bias and prejudice
>when a matter concerns one of their own. Witness the issue of Madame
>Ashleana's illegal challenge if ye will and rest assured that tis nae the
>only time such bias hast been exercised.
>
>Jona
>
What other times have we not heard of?
G'nort Espelande G'neesmacher Dragoon Talanador
Head of House Dragoon Talanador
Thrice Baron of the DoS
"When I left you, I was but the learner, now I am the master"
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From: foxxgrrl@aol.com (Foxxgrrl)
Date: 17 Apr 1999 20:13:45 EDT
>While your words make sense Ally, as I consider it, I don't think that Jaycy
>breaking the rules should be forgiven because she indirectly did the other
>warlord a favor. That would be taking away the fact that she broke a rule.
Var,
I don't think that Jaycy's improper challenge should be forgiven because she "did Lucian a favor," and I didn't mean to imply that. In fact, I didn't mean to say that Lucian was done a favor, as I don't believe he was. My point was merely to have people consider what Lucian's motivations were in challenging. Claiming he was "robbed" on general principle seemed strong to me, but I did not mean to say he should be thankful to Jaycy.
-Ally
Date: 17 Apr 1999 20:13:45 EDT
>While your words make sense Ally, as I consider it, I don't think that Jaycy
>breaking the rules should be forgiven because she indirectly did the other
>warlord a favor. That would be taking away the fact that she broke a rule.
Var,
I don't think that Jaycy's improper challenge should be forgiven because she "did Lucian a favor," and I didn't mean to imply that. In fact, I didn't mean to say that Lucian was done a favor, as I don't believe he was. My point was merely to have people consider what Lucian's motivations were in challenging. Claiming he was "robbed" on general principle seemed strong to me, but I did not mean to say he should be thankful to Jaycy.
-Ally
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From: foxxgrrl@aol.com (Foxxgrrl)
Date: 17 Apr 1999 20:26:33 EDT
Jona,
I do not remember any animosity between us in the past. We have not been best friends by any means, but I was not aware you felt this strongly about me - or that you could so easily lump me into the same group as Skyler, and dismiss us both with the same question. So perhaps I was ignorant not to have seen this coming, but allow me, please, to ask you one last favor.
Don't insult what I meant to provoke people's thoughts simply because I lack the ability to effectively judge character. I thought a different view of the situation (not even an opinion, mind you) might be expressed without you taking offense. Apparently, the expression "live and learn" applies to me here. I've certainly learned a thing or two.
-Ally Saint-Reynolds
Date: 17 Apr 1999 20:26:33 EDT
Jona,
I do not remember any animosity between us in the past. We have not been best friends by any means, but I was not aware you felt this strongly about me - or that you could so easily lump me into the same group as Skyler, and dismiss us both with the same question. So perhaps I was ignorant not to have seen this coming, but allow me, please, to ask you one last favor.
Don't insult what I meant to provoke people's thoughts simply because I lack the ability to effectively judge character. I thought a different view of the situation (not even an opinion, mind you) might be expressed without you taking offense. Apparently, the expression "live and learn" applies to me here. I've certainly learned a thing or two.
-Ally Saint-Reynolds
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From: sidarthae@aol.com (Sidartha E)
Date: 17 Apr 1999 22:23:35 EDT
Coron
I dinna give a damn who she is, and her wearing a uniform dinna cut it either. The officials of this sport hae shown a distinct bias and prejudice when a matter concerns one of their own. Witness the issue of Madame Ashleana's illegal challenge if ye will and rest assured that tis nae the only time such bias hast been exercised.
Jona
<<
Community~
I find it odd that no one addresses Lady Helix's part in this situation. As I remember, the challenge was allowed to go through because Helix had told Jaycy that the Challenge was valid by mistake and chose to fix it by allowing the Challenge to go through anyway.
And yet, I have not yet seen one word penned referring to *her* as a "fleebitten lion" or other such nonsense. Of course, I am in no way condoning such actions as the pointless insulting, but it does seem odd that Helix is not even mentioned.
~Sidartha
Date: 17 Apr 1999 22:23:35 EDT
Coron
I dinna give a damn who she is, and her wearing a uniform dinna cut it either. The officials of this sport hae shown a distinct bias and prejudice when a matter concerns one of their own. Witness the issue of Madame Ashleana's illegal challenge if ye will and rest assured that tis nae the only time such bias hast been exercised.
Jona
<<
Community~
I find it odd that no one addresses Lady Helix's part in this situation. As I remember, the challenge was allowed to go through because Helix had told Jaycy that the Challenge was valid by mistake and chose to fix it by allowing the Challenge to go through anyway.
And yet, I have not yet seen one word penned referring to *her* as a "fleebitten lion" or other such nonsense. Of course, I am in no way condoning such actions as the pointless insulting, but it does seem odd that Helix is not even mentioned.
~Sidartha
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From: sidarthae@aol.com (Sidartha E)
Date: 17 Apr 1999 22:25:22 EDT
<<Ally
I shall ask thee the same question I once didst ask 'o Skyler. Aire thee just naturally ignorant or do thee work hard at it?
Jona>>
Can we stick to the subject please?
~Sid
Date: 17 Apr 1999 22:25:22 EDT
<<Ally
I shall ask thee the same question I once didst ask 'o Skyler. Aire thee just naturally ignorant or do thee work hard at it?
Jona>>
Can we stick to the subject please?
~Sid
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From: quickvarmg@aol.com (QuickVarMG)
Date: 17 Apr 1999 22:34:54 EDT
"<<Ally
I shall ask thee the same question I once didst ask 'o Skyler. Aire thee just naturally ignorant or do thee work hard at it?
Jona>>
Can we stick to the subject please?"
Yes, we can always stick to the subject, but if we will is a completely different story.
I think that we should actually worry about it, however, if a debate begins whether Ally is ignorant or not. I don't think she is, personally. However, I just hope this doesn't begin to form into that "Whether or not Tim is an idiot" like debate.
Var Medici-Giovanni
±
|¯Proud father, proud husband¯|
|¯Holder of the Tenth Ring¯|
|¯Soul dedicated to Noelle¯|
|¯Devoted to his children¯|
Date: 17 Apr 1999 22:34:54 EDT
"<<Ally
I shall ask thee the same question I once didst ask 'o Skyler. Aire thee just naturally ignorant or do thee work hard at it?
Jona>>
Can we stick to the subject please?"
Yes, we can always stick to the subject, but if we will is a completely different story.
I think that we should actually worry about it, however, if a debate begins whether Ally is ignorant or not. I don't think she is, personally. However, I just hope this doesn't begin to form into that "Whether or not Tim is an idiot" like debate.
Var Medici-Giovanni
±
|¯Proud father, proud husband¯|
|¯Holder of the Tenth Ring¯|
|¯Soul dedicated to Noelle¯|
|¯Devoted to his children¯|
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From: takcouma@aol.com (Takcouma)
Date: 18 Apr 1999 01:43:11 EDT
::She walks to the corkboard and glances over all the post and many others and is surprised at the subject content::
Overlord Montoya,
Ye ne'er cease to amaze me with yer manners, skills, and knowledge. The way in which ye conduct yerself upon accepting Jaycy's challenge 'as the voice and mannerisms of honor. For a time now, I 'ave wished to see an overlord represent the example of what I see as honor. I nae 'ave chance to visit often the arena as duties I must attend to keep me away. But tis ne'er taken away me desire nor love of the sport. Tis nae makes me ranking or me
less honorable than what me history speaks of itself for me. Tis nae to say that I do nay practice with me blade elsewhere and therefore am less qualified to challenge for any rank in which I see meself fit. I must say that in the past I 'ave witnessed in ye what I deem as excellent and fine material for overlordship. Your past history speaks well enough that I can condone no complaints. Although Jaycy is an acquaintance of mine and I 'ave nae a
complaint of her, I can nae refrain from saying I do hope ye retain the position as Overlord. Tis nae to say I shall 'ave complaint ifin the title becomes hers either. I am just pleased as to yer holding it now. In me thoughts, I just thinkst that knowing history accounts for much and it should nae ever be forgotten. A king who leaves his homeland should nae be scrutinized ifin he returns and wants to rule it. sometimes that King can bring a
lesson back because he 'as been on the outside. Tis me perspective and nay can I stray from it.
I wish luck to ye both.
Marit Takcouma.
Date: 18 Apr 1999 01:43:11 EDT
::She walks to the corkboard and glances over all the post and many others and is surprised at the subject content::
Overlord Montoya,
Ye ne'er cease to amaze me with yer manners, skills, and knowledge. The way in which ye conduct yerself upon accepting Jaycy's challenge 'as the voice and mannerisms of honor. For a time now, I 'ave wished to see an overlord represent the example of what I see as honor. I nae 'ave chance to visit often the arena as duties I must attend to keep me away. But tis ne'er taken away me desire nor love of the sport. Tis nae makes me ranking or me
less honorable than what me history speaks of itself for me. Tis nae to say that I do nay practice with me blade elsewhere and therefore am less qualified to challenge for any rank in which I see meself fit. I must say that in the past I 'ave witnessed in ye what I deem as excellent and fine material for overlordship. Your past history speaks well enough that I can condone no complaints. Although Jaycy is an acquaintance of mine and I 'ave nae a
complaint of her, I can nae refrain from saying I do hope ye retain the position as Overlord. Tis nae to say I shall 'ave complaint ifin the title becomes hers either. I am just pleased as to yer holding it now. In me thoughts, I just thinkst that knowing history accounts for much and it should nae ever be forgotten. A king who leaves his homeland should nae be scrutinized ifin he returns and wants to rule it. sometimes that King can bring a
lesson back because he 'as been on the outside. Tis me perspective and nay can I stray from it.
I wish luck to ye both.
Marit Takcouma.
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From: jonalyn@aol.com (Jonalyn)
Date: 18 Apr 1999 01:53:40 EDT
Ally,
Lass, mine pardon. Yet tis seeming thee aire simply asking questions what hae been answered repeatedly. If that isna the case, mine apology.
Jona
As usual, does not deem Sidie Poo's comment worth a reply, though they are, as usual, amusing in their ignorance. "Och, ye hae to thin' senility hae nae only been creepin' up on th' old lady, bu' hae taken roost quite comfortably."
Jonalyn Nenshen Starfare
Commoner, Duel of Swords
Regent of Auravia
Co-Chancellor of Starhaven
Queen of Westridge, and the Provinces.
Regent for the heirs to Auravia and Westridge.
Date: 18 Apr 1999 01:53:40 EDT
Ally,
Lass, mine pardon. Yet tis seeming thee aire simply asking questions what hae been answered repeatedly. If that isna the case, mine apology.
Jona
As usual, does not deem Sidie Poo's comment worth a reply, though they are, as usual, amusing in their ignorance. "Och, ye hae to thin' senility hae nae only been creepin' up on th' old lady, bu' hae taken roost quite comfortably."
Jonalyn Nenshen Starfare
Commoner, Duel of Swords
Regent of Auravia
Co-Chancellor of Starhaven
Queen of Westridge, and the Provinces.
Regent for the heirs to Auravia and Westridge.
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From: drakewyni@aol.com (Drakewyn I)
Date: 18 Apr 1999 05:55:55 EDT
Lady Lasher writes: "Be advised that name calling ends now. Stay to the issues. If you have a complaint or point to discuss do so, but with decorum, please."
Lady Starfare writes: "Lass,
Since when didst thee become the model one shouldst look to for delicacy and decorum?"
It is quite obvious that Lady Lasher is not declaring herself the model that others should look to. After a discussion with her, I have learned that she is was only indicating that she will be enforcing the rules handed down to her by the management of the Inn and its environs.
The saddest part of this is... I remember a time when such rules weren't required, for people showed decorum and respect to each other on these boards as a matter of course.
Lady Drake, aka the Gryphon.
Date: 18 Apr 1999 05:55:55 EDT
Lady Lasher writes: "Be advised that name calling ends now. Stay to the issues. If you have a complaint or point to discuss do so, but with decorum, please."
Lady Starfare writes: "Lass,
Since when didst thee become the model one shouldst look to for delicacy and decorum?"
It is quite obvious that Lady Lasher is not declaring herself the model that others should look to. After a discussion with her, I have learned that she is was only indicating that she will be enforcing the rules handed down to her by the management of the Inn and its environs.
The saddest part of this is... I remember a time when such rules weren't required, for people showed decorum and respect to each other on these boards as a matter of course.
Lady Drake, aka the Gryphon.
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From: dexm@aol.com (Dex M)
Date: 18 Apr 1999 16:58:30 EDT
(( a copy for the Public awareness ))
Renegade Baron and Baroness,
Upon reflection regarding this challenge I have some questions that have been tasking me. I will be as usual placing a copy of this letter upon the cork.
First, to the Baroness,
Allow me if you will, to paraphrase and interpret from you original letter of challenge that your reason of challenge is my absence from the rings prior to my challenge to Senor de Oro. Also my lack of dueling in the about one week interval between that declaration of challenge and the match itself. This is fairly straightforward.
What does puzzle me is why the Baroness cannot look me in the eye when I am in the room, and why such heavy sighs in my presence? I leave that for her to enlighten me on.
Second, Regarding the Baron.
Yet, even more puzzling to me is my question regarding the Senior Baron. I was disappointed in hearing of his alignment and even more so the minimal communication from one I had considered an old friend as to why. I am unable to locate his declaration of Renegade either on the boards, nor in missive as the other Barons had done. I presumed he had made such declaration as required to the Standings Keeper and had asked her to let me know the date of
the declaration but alas the record of such declaration has gone missing.
As a result, I am asking that Baron Oakenshield please publicly state the reasons he has chosen his stance of Renegade and if he could provide me a time frame at which he made the decision.
Dex Montoya
Loyal to Rhydin
Date: 18 Apr 1999 16:58:30 EDT
(( a copy for the Public awareness ))
Renegade Baron and Baroness,
Upon reflection regarding this challenge I have some questions that have been tasking me. I will be as usual placing a copy of this letter upon the cork.
First, to the Baroness,
Allow me if you will, to paraphrase and interpret from you original letter of challenge that your reason of challenge is my absence from the rings prior to my challenge to Senor de Oro. Also my lack of dueling in the about one week interval between that declaration of challenge and the match itself. This is fairly straightforward.
What does puzzle me is why the Baroness cannot look me in the eye when I am in the room, and why such heavy sighs in my presence? I leave that for her to enlighten me on.
Second, Regarding the Baron.
Yet, even more puzzling to me is my question regarding the Senior Baron. I was disappointed in hearing of his alignment and even more so the minimal communication from one I had considered an old friend as to why. I am unable to locate his declaration of Renegade either on the boards, nor in missive as the other Barons had done. I presumed he had made such declaration as required to the Standings Keeper and had asked her to let me know the date of
the declaration but alas the record of such declaration has gone missing.
As a result, I am asking that Baron Oakenshield please publicly state the reasons he has chosen his stance of Renegade and if he could provide me a time frame at which he made the decision.
Dex Montoya
Loyal to Rhydin
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From: dexm@aol.com (Dex M)
Date: 23 Apr 1999 23:21:20 EDT
To the community at large,
I wanted to thank each person who has offered their blade to me in testing the challenger. Support in the matter has crossed all bounds, some from friendship, some from grievance with my challenger, some as a matter of principle. My decisions are not solely based on popular support, yet I admit to having felt the tug of the political mechanisms.
I have noted by the recent standings that the Renegade Baroness has regained the WoL to hold the rank of a Warlord. This then, may change the feelings of some on the issue.
I would at this time wish to announce the two tentative dates of April 29th at the hour of 12 EST Midnight or April 25th in the evening for the challenge match so any that desire to come may do so.
Dex Montoya
Loyal to Rhydin
Date: 23 Apr 1999 23:21:20 EDT
To the community at large,
I wanted to thank each person who has offered their blade to me in testing the challenger. Support in the matter has crossed all bounds, some from friendship, some from grievance with my challenger, some as a matter of principle. My decisions are not solely based on popular support, yet I admit to having felt the tug of the political mechanisms.
I have noted by the recent standings that the Renegade Baroness has regained the WoL to hold the rank of a Warlord. This then, may change the feelings of some on the issue.
I would at this time wish to announce the two tentative dates of April 29th at the hour of 12 EST Midnight or April 25th in the evening for the challenge match so any that desire to come may do so.
Dex Montoya
Loyal to Rhydin
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From: eagleecore@aol.com (EagleEcore)
Date: 24 Apr 1999 02:23:48 EDT
Overlord,
I was even one of the Baroness Jaycynda's wins the past weekend that helped her acheive her current record of 15 WoLs. Does it change my views or opinions about her challenge? No.
I have stated, though disappointed in her actions, I think she is a fine person, a decent duelist, and could be a decent leader even, because she's been allright as a Baroness.
It's the same thing I said about Cris de Oro, though it seemed to upset him enough to have me thrown off the Bladesingers TDL team. While I may find them, and other duelists, to even be my friends besides being decent respectable duelists with many fine qualities, I don't think they should have challenged for Overlord.
If the Baroness Jaycynda would have waited to get her record up to a more acceptable previous standard before challenging for Overlord, then my attitude would be different, but since she couldn't and was selfish in her desires without regards to the title she seeks, I still can not condone her challenge actions. Since I was so vocal before in my response to her challenge, I figured it best to simply give the community an update on my current and
same stance.
And as I stated a hundred times before, while WoLs is not the end all be all of defining a dueler's worth, in my opinion it is one of several factors to consider for defining a worthy Overlord, IMHO.
~Ecore
Date: 24 Apr 1999 02:23:48 EDT
Overlord,
I was even one of the Baroness Jaycynda's wins the past weekend that helped her acheive her current record of 15 WoLs. Does it change my views or opinions about her challenge? No.
I have stated, though disappointed in her actions, I think she is a fine person, a decent duelist, and could be a decent leader even, because she's been allright as a Baroness.
It's the same thing I said about Cris de Oro, though it seemed to upset him enough to have me thrown off the Bladesingers TDL team. While I may find them, and other duelists, to even be my friends besides being decent respectable duelists with many fine qualities, I don't think they should have challenged for Overlord.
If the Baroness Jaycynda would have waited to get her record up to a more acceptable previous standard before challenging for Overlord, then my attitude would be different, but since she couldn't and was selfish in her desires without regards to the title she seeks, I still can not condone her challenge actions. Since I was so vocal before in my response to her challenge, I figured it best to simply give the community an update on my current and
same stance.
And as I stated a hundred times before, while WoLs is not the end all be all of defining a dueler's worth, in my opinion it is one of several factors to consider for defining a worthy Overlord, IMHO.
~Ecore
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From: jonalyn@aol.com (Jonalyn)
Date: 24 Apr 1999 04:02:00 EDT
Overlord Coindextint Dexter Montoya
I do reiterate mine off of mine blade unto thee. Further, Madame Ashleana's record ist nae now or e'er wast of import to me. Mine reasons stand for nae considering the Baroness either worthy to challenge for the Crown or, for that matter, to hold the Third Ring. I will nae honor nor support a personage what didst gain her title by deceit, nor shall I honor nor support her in that she didst display cowardice ast well ast eschewing accepting
responsibility for her own deeds.
Hast honor so far fled these ancient halls that the Barons, the Warlords, nae e'en those of lesser rank will nae stand forth and offer their blades unto the Overlord? Wilt thou stand in silence, thine pens and voices stilled whilst such a travesty ast this challenge ist made?
Fie on thee!! Friend or nae, dost condone a lie? Dost condone deceit in the titled ranks? Ask of thine heart, wouldst truly wish such a personage to lead this community? Wouldst be proud to tell thine children that thee kept silent?
Jonalyn Starfare
Strides away from the board, too much of a lady to tell Madame Silvertree precisely where she can stick her comments.
Date: 24 Apr 1999 04:02:00 EDT
Overlord Coindextint Dexter Montoya
I do reiterate mine off of mine blade unto thee. Further, Madame Ashleana's record ist nae now or e'er wast of import to me. Mine reasons stand for nae considering the Baroness either worthy to challenge for the Crown or, for that matter, to hold the Third Ring. I will nae honor nor support a personage what didst gain her title by deceit, nor shall I honor nor support her in that she didst display cowardice ast well ast eschewing accepting
responsibility for her own deeds.
Hast honor so far fled these ancient halls that the Barons, the Warlords, nae e'en those of lesser rank will nae stand forth and offer their blades unto the Overlord? Wilt thou stand in silence, thine pens and voices stilled whilst such a travesty ast this challenge ist made?
Fie on thee!! Friend or nae, dost condone a lie? Dost condone deceit in the titled ranks? Ask of thine heart, wouldst truly wish such a personage to lead this community? Wouldst be proud to tell thine children that thee kept silent?
Jonalyn Starfare
Strides away from the board, too much of a lady to tell Madame Silvertree precisely where she can stick her comments.
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From: dexm@aol.com (Dex M)
Date: 25 Apr 1999 15:24:37 EDT
An update from the Overlord,
I would like to clarify to you that the tentative date of tonight will NOT be used for the challenge. The Baroness and I have discussed the issue of callers and I am presently arranging the officiator for the duel as per our discussions.
I would like to take a moment to ramble at this time about a thought that I have considered for some time.
History,
I have oft stated that all will not share the same views or opinions and that we will make decisions based upon those views. History will then show that not all will love us, nor hate us, nor even care a whit about our views. The decisions and actions we make will range from strongly influencing those around us to being nothing more than a simple line in an archive of some historian. History will set forth its judgment, sometimes skewed by the
historians view, of our actions as either insightful or personal folly. The final line will always become a matter of what we personally feel.
Dex Montoya
Loyal to Rhydin
Date: 25 Apr 1999 15:24:37 EDT
An update from the Overlord,
I would like to clarify to you that the tentative date of tonight will NOT be used for the challenge. The Baroness and I have discussed the issue of callers and I am presently arranging the officiator for the duel as per our discussions.
I would like to take a moment to ramble at this time about a thought that I have considered for some time.
History,
I have oft stated that all will not share the same views or opinions and that we will make decisions based upon those views. History will then show that not all will love us, nor hate us, nor even care a whit about our views. The decisions and actions we make will range from strongly influencing those around us to being nothing more than a simple line in an archive of some historian. History will set forth its judgment, sometimes skewed by the
historians view, of our actions as either insightful or personal folly. The final line will always become a matter of what we personally feel.
Dex Montoya
Loyal to Rhydin
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From: drakewyni@aol.com (Drakewyn I)
Date: 26 Apr 1999 05:04:55 EDT
Lady Starfare.
Find thyself a cliff and leap from it.
Those who know me, know my mind on this challenge. I find -any- who challenge quickly upon the heels of a title holder's victory, especially the Overlord, to be in the wrong, regardless of who they are and what they have done.
Lady Drake, aka the Gryphon.
Date: 26 Apr 1999 05:04:55 EDT
Lady Starfare.
Find thyself a cliff and leap from it.
Those who know me, know my mind on this challenge. I find -any- who challenge quickly upon the heels of a title holder's victory, especially the Overlord, to be in the wrong, regardless of who they are and what they have done.
Lady Drake, aka the Gryphon.