From: dueier@aol.com (DueIer)
Date: 16 Jan 1998 01:19:47 EST
((Body as mailed to the requisite parties))
Overlord, Barons, Warlords, and all other patrons of the Duel of Swords that may be interested,
So comes a time in a nameless dueler's short career as a Warlord that he shall have gathered the requisite peer wins in order to issue challenge to a baron. The questions are, to make a challenge, or not? Is there ample reason? Who shall be the target?
With the recent update of the history center, I have been able to determine that the Baroness Queen Luthien Tinuviel, Lady Tynsdale, has gone the longest of Barons/Baronesses since the time of the last challenge. On a side note, it may be mentioned that, according to the history center, the last challenger for the ring had those reasons behind their challenge.
The renegade barons are all being flooded with challenges. I have nothing against the Overlord, but I feel that not enough of those Barons loyal to himself are challenged, and too many renegades are being challenged. I remain Loyal as I can to the Overlord, while stating thus:
On this morning of January the sixteenth by the standard eastern reckoning, in the Year of our Lord one-thousand, nine-hundred and ninety-eight, I((DueIer)) officially do issue challenge to Loyal Baroness Queen Luthien Tinuviel, Lady Tynsdale((QnLuthien)), for her possession of the 9th Barony.
The requisite peer wins:
1. DueIer def. Perrinis 6.5-5 in 10 rounds 1/8
2. DueIer def. PKardinal 5-2 in 10 rounds 1/8
3. DueIer def. Spikushell 5-4 in 9 rounds 1/10
4. DueIer def. Kingphisch 5.5-3 in 9 rounds 1/10
5. DueIer def. Dakich 5-2 in 7 rounds 1/10
6. DueIer def. MDickey586 5-3 in 8 rounds 1/10
7. DueIer def. XxLucianxX 5-3 in 11 rounds 1/10
8. DueIer def. Gnimish RW 5-3 in 8 rounds 1/15
9. DueIer def. J Oaknshld 5-2 in 9 rounds 1/15
10. DueIer def. Jakvaltrds 5-3.5 in 14 rounds 1/15
Should any of these wins not check out, I would be rather astonished, as 3 of them took place mere hours ago, and the other 7 showed up on the results list. If a wait is required to process the peer wins due to them being extremely recent, I will accept that.
I answer the paradox of loyalty thus: I stand for what the Overlord stands for, but I still believe that his Barons should be tested every two months, at least, to see if they are still worthy of holding the position, or if another should take their place. The reason I do not challenge a renegade is thus: They have all made multiple defenses in the past weeks, and are therefore worthy of their positions, regardless of whether they have the
same political views as myself.
I understand there are many opposite viewpoints in this matter. If the Overlord wishes to use a Test of Worthiness on me, I certainly have no objections. I do not expect a Renegade to step in on such a Test, though if they do, I would be thankful were they to help me on my way.
In conclusion, I make this challenge as merely a test for myself and for the Baroness. I steadfastly hold onto my loyalty to the Overlord, even if he were to test me. I hold no ill will against any person, save any of those that would challenge the Overlord for his position.
This has been proclaimed by the one known as:
~The Nameless Dueler~
known also as "DueIer" or "The nameless one"
Baronial Challenge
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From: jakvaltrds@aol.com (Jakvaltrds)
Date: 16 Jan 1998 14:40:22 EST
::Smiling as he finds himself listed in the mans victories:::
Ye fought well Dueler, and I have no doubt tae yer skills. I wish you luck in this but must side with loyal Baroness.
Skill and honor, may it guide both blades on the apointed eve!
~Seamus~
Date: 16 Jan 1998 14:40:22 EST
::Smiling as he finds himself listed in the mans victories:::
Ye fought well Dueler, and I have no doubt tae yer skills. I wish you luck in this but must side with loyal Baroness.
Skill and honor, may it guide both blades on the apointed eve!
~Seamus~
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From: iainmacknz@aol.com (IainMacKnz)
Date: 17 Jan 1998 06:50:40 EST
To... whomever you are.
Greetings. While I hold no personal animosity against you for your challenge, be aware that its issuance has forced me out of retirement.
As you appear to have studied the histories, I am certain that you are aware of the exact reason for this.
I will hope that you will not have cause to meet me within the ring, yet advise you now to prepare for the possibility.
With due respect,
Iain MacKenzie
Lord Tynsdale
Prince Consort, New Mountainside
Warlord and Thrice-Baron of the Duel of Swords, retired for the moment.
Date: 17 Jan 1998 06:50:40 EST
To... whomever you are.
Greetings. While I hold no personal animosity against you for your challenge, be aware that its issuance has forced me out of retirement.
As you appear to have studied the histories, I am certain that you are aware of the exact reason for this.
I will hope that you will not have cause to meet me within the ring, yet advise you now to prepare for the possibility.
With due respect,
Iain MacKenzie
Lord Tynsdale
Prince Consort, New Mountainside
Warlord and Thrice-Baron of the Duel of Swords, retired for the moment.
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From: dueier@aol.com (DueIer)
Date: 17 Jan 1998 15:36:03 EST
Lord Tynsdale,
If you wish to issue challenge for the 9th ring should I be successful in my challenge against the Baroness, I certainly have no qualms about it. I understand your motives very well, and will not argue with you about it. For it would be an argument I certainly would not win, nor one that I have much basis to argue about.
Patrons,
While I am here on the message boards, let me sahre with you my thoughts on the Warlord "Darkness2"'s challenge to Baron Ulath ni Fici, and the outcry over it:
I find that lack of outcry at my challenge very comforting, as if the patrons feel mine is "better" in some way. I certainly believe that anyone who does challenge merely for the sake of challenging, and that their primary target has been taken, and who has done little research into the Baron or the ring, has a rather poor reason to challenge. That the peer wins are mere hours old is of no consequence to me, for I listed mine as such as well.
I hope you all realize how my challenge differs from that of the other 2-week Warlord. I certainly did not make this on a whim, but had been studying that histories and the Barons for the length of time since I made Master at Arms. That Lady Tynsdale has had a mere 1 challenge in about 7 months, presumably due to the oath of protecting the ring, shows lack of courage in the populous of the DoS Warlords, or lack of faith in their skills. I
have the courage to take on the obstacle, and do have faith in myself that it is possible. Were Luthien to have received challenge recently, I hope you all would believe that I would not have issued challenge this soon.
I also make this challenge for an un-written reason, and a reason that is supported by the Warlord "Darkness2"'s challenge, and one I hope you all do not take negatively. I wish to see the challenge system modified. Currently it it all too easy for relatively inexperienced Warlords to issue challenge to Barons. I understand there was a rules discussion a few months ago, and I wished I had shared my thoughts then. I do not know what was
brought up about the challenge system, but there should be something more to challenging than just defeating 10 of your peers. Perhaps correlate it with the Warlord ranking system. I do not know, and this certainly not the correct place to discuss it.
I certainly hope my challenge did not cause "Darkness2" to issue his, and if it did, I sincerly apologize for influence the young Warlord such that he should make such a brash move.
~The Nameless Dueler~
Otherwise known as "DueIer", "the nameless one" or, in the words of Lord Tynsdale, "whomever you are"
Date: 17 Jan 1998 15:36:03 EST
Lord Tynsdale,
If you wish to issue challenge for the 9th ring should I be successful in my challenge against the Baroness, I certainly have no qualms about it. I understand your motives very well, and will not argue with you about it. For it would be an argument I certainly would not win, nor one that I have much basis to argue about.
Patrons,
While I am here on the message boards, let me sahre with you my thoughts on the Warlord "Darkness2"'s challenge to Baron Ulath ni Fici, and the outcry over it:
I find that lack of outcry at my challenge very comforting, as if the patrons feel mine is "better" in some way. I certainly believe that anyone who does challenge merely for the sake of challenging, and that their primary target has been taken, and who has done little research into the Baron or the ring, has a rather poor reason to challenge. That the peer wins are mere hours old is of no consequence to me, for I listed mine as such as well.
I hope you all realize how my challenge differs from that of the other 2-week Warlord. I certainly did not make this on a whim, but had been studying that histories and the Barons for the length of time since I made Master at Arms. That Lady Tynsdale has had a mere 1 challenge in about 7 months, presumably due to the oath of protecting the ring, shows lack of courage in the populous of the DoS Warlords, or lack of faith in their skills. I
have the courage to take on the obstacle, and do have faith in myself that it is possible. Were Luthien to have received challenge recently, I hope you all would believe that I would not have issued challenge this soon.
I also make this challenge for an un-written reason, and a reason that is supported by the Warlord "Darkness2"'s challenge, and one I hope you all do not take negatively. I wish to see the challenge system modified. Currently it it all too easy for relatively inexperienced Warlords to issue challenge to Barons. I understand there was a rules discussion a few months ago, and I wished I had shared my thoughts then. I do not know what was
brought up about the challenge system, but there should be something more to challenging than just defeating 10 of your peers. Perhaps correlate it with the Warlord ranking system. I do not know, and this certainly not the correct place to discuss it.
I certainly hope my challenge did not cause "Darkness2" to issue his, and if it did, I sincerly apologize for influence the young Warlord such that he should make such a brash move.
~The Nameless Dueler~
Otherwise known as "DueIer", "the nameless one" or, in the words of Lord Tynsdale, "whomever you are"
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From: dexmontoy@aol.com (Dex Montoy)
Date: 17 Jan 1998 16:35:26 EST
:: grunts at the lack of courage part ::
:: thinks the nameless one knows not what he speaks ::
Date: 17 Jan 1998 16:35:26 EST
:: grunts at the lack of courage part ::
:: thinks the nameless one knows not what he speaks ::
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From: drakewynx@aol.com (Drakewyn x)
Date: 20 Jan 1998 19:44:14 EST
To the self-proclaimed nameless dueler:
To put it quite simply, Luthien has not been challenged because she is much loved by this community of duelers. She is one of the most tireless of callers... the most friendly of Baron(ess)s... and quite simply, a wonderful person. Look at all the duelers, myself included, that could easily challenge at any time... yet we choose not to. Is it because we lack confidence? No. It is because we do not feel the need to challenge... To
most of us, the Duel of Swords is more than just a "sport". It is a place of honor. If you feel that a Baron(ess) should not go more than three or four months without receiving a challenge, that is your right. But perhaps you should look into the reasons that person hasn't been challenged.
Thank you for your time.
Lady Drake.
Date: 20 Jan 1998 19:44:14 EST
To the self-proclaimed nameless dueler:
To put it quite simply, Luthien has not been challenged because she is much loved by this community of duelers. She is one of the most tireless of callers... the most friendly of Baron(ess)s... and quite simply, a wonderful person. Look at all the duelers, myself included, that could easily challenge at any time... yet we choose not to. Is it because we lack confidence? No. It is because we do not feel the need to challenge... To
most of us, the Duel of Swords is more than just a "sport". It is a place of honor. If you feel that a Baron(ess) should not go more than three or four months without receiving a challenge, that is your right. But perhaps you should look into the reasons that person hasn't been challenged.
Thank you for your time.
Lady Drake.
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From: dueier@aol.com (DueIer)
Date: 21 Jan 1998 20:22:33 EST
Drakewyn:
<<Luthien has not been challenged because she is much loved by this community of duelers. She is one of the most tireless of callers... the most friendly of Baron(ess)s... and quite simply, a wonderful person>>
Very nicely put. I now see the reason why people did not really wish to challenge Luthien. Challenging a popular figure makes you unpopular. No one has had the *courage* to come up and do such an act until a new face walks in and does not understand all of what goes on in the DoS. May I point you to Gnimish and Adeena, a supposed friendly challenge, in which the challenged turned against the challenger. I by no means wish to say that Adeena
and Luthien are alike in any way, but am merely using this to try to demonstrate my point.
Forgive me if I am wrong, but are the Barons supposed those that are nicest to the community? Surely this is nice, but being a Baron also means showing the skill to obtain, and then defend the ring. I merely wish to test if she still possesses it after months without challenge. Hopefully there is no hard feelings towards me about this, though if there were I would understand and not really care. If everyone wishes to find reasons why I am
wrong, do so. It better helps me to understand this community, and in the process understand myself better as well.
Thank you,
~The Nameless DueIer~
aka "DueIer" et al
Date: 21 Jan 1998 20:22:33 EST
Drakewyn:
<<Luthien has not been challenged because she is much loved by this community of duelers. She is one of the most tireless of callers... the most friendly of Baron(ess)s... and quite simply, a wonderful person>>
Very nicely put. I now see the reason why people did not really wish to challenge Luthien. Challenging a popular figure makes you unpopular. No one has had the *courage* to come up and do such an act until a new face walks in and does not understand all of what goes on in the DoS. May I point you to Gnimish and Adeena, a supposed friendly challenge, in which the challenged turned against the challenger. I by no means wish to say that Adeena
and Luthien are alike in any way, but am merely using this to try to demonstrate my point.
Forgive me if I am wrong, but are the Barons supposed those that are nicest to the community? Surely this is nice, but being a Baron also means showing the skill to obtain, and then defend the ring. I merely wish to test if she still possesses it after months without challenge. Hopefully there is no hard feelings towards me about this, though if there were I would understand and not really care. If everyone wishes to find reasons why I am
wrong, do so. It better helps me to understand this community, and in the process understand myself better as well.
Thank you,
~The Nameless DueIer~
aka "DueIer" et al
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From: qnluthien@aol.com (QnLuthien)
Date: 22 Jan 1998 00:53:03 EST
To the nameless one.
>>I merely wish to test if she still possesses it after months without challenge. Hopefully there is no hard feelings towards me about this<<
I cannot help but ask the question... What have you done to put yourself to the higher position where you feel obligated to test me. Yes by all rights and by all rules, you've gained rank, you've gained peer wins. But that...... oh Nameless one, does not distinguish you from the masses. Did you receive a sign from your gods.."Thou shalt be the distributor of Tests" ?? How oft have you seen me defeated in the rings. I
assure you, I am quite practiced up. A thursday night duel in the Arena is a duel. I've gone months witout challenge, but I've not gone months without dueling. As for hard feelings, I don't have an exorbitant amount of them. Just the expected levels, within reason for one who's skill is being questioned.
>>It better helps me to understand this community, and in the process understand myself better as well.<<
As for the above quote... please spare us this patronization. You've challenged me, I accept that. No need to sugar coat it 'lest it begin to leave an offensive aftertaste.
I am, daring to go beyond the boundaries of nice.
Queen Luthien Tinuviel-MacKenzie
Lady Tynsdale
Baron # 9
Date: 22 Jan 1998 00:53:03 EST
To the nameless one.
>>I merely wish to test if she still possesses it after months without challenge. Hopefully there is no hard feelings towards me about this<<
I cannot help but ask the question... What have you done to put yourself to the higher position where you feel obligated to test me. Yes by all rights and by all rules, you've gained rank, you've gained peer wins. But that...... oh Nameless one, does not distinguish you from the masses. Did you receive a sign from your gods.."Thou shalt be the distributor of Tests" ?? How oft have you seen me defeated in the rings. I
assure you, I am quite practiced up. A thursday night duel in the Arena is a duel. I've gone months witout challenge, but I've not gone months without dueling. As for hard feelings, I don't have an exorbitant amount of them. Just the expected levels, within reason for one who's skill is being questioned.
>>It better helps me to understand this community, and in the process understand myself better as well.<<
As for the above quote... please spare us this patronization. You've challenged me, I accept that. No need to sugar coat it 'lest it begin to leave an offensive aftertaste.
I am, daring to go beyond the boundaries of nice.
Queen Luthien Tinuviel-MacKenzie
Lady Tynsdale
Baron # 9
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From: iainmacknz@aol.com (IainMacKnz)
Date: 22 Jan 1998 02:02:20 EST
He who remains nameless:
Drakewyn's point was not that nobody had the courage to challenge my wife. It was that very few have any desire to see her influence removed from the Baron's Council; that they respect her and desire for her to retain the rank.
Admittedly, perhaps there are those who do not feel that way, and it's quite likely that fear has kept them from challenging her - but certainly not fear of unpopularity. Perhaps fear of her blade - which may be an odd concept for you, as it has been with some others who have passed through these rings.
~irm
Date: 22 Jan 1998 02:02:20 EST
He who remains nameless:
Drakewyn's point was not that nobody had the courage to challenge my wife. It was that very few have any desire to see her influence removed from the Baron's Council; that they respect her and desire for her to retain the rank.
Admittedly, perhaps there are those who do not feel that way, and it's quite likely that fear has kept them from challenging her - but certainly not fear of unpopularity. Perhaps fear of her blade - which may be an odd concept for you, as it has been with some others who have passed through these rings.
~irm
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From: prlunicorn@aol.com (PrlUnicorn)
Date: 22 Jan 1998 03:44:38 EST
Iain,
Damned straight, the lass is a peach!
Colleen MacLeod
Queuekeeper of DoS
Date: 22 Jan 1998 03:44:38 EST
Iain,
Damned straight, the lass is a peach!
Colleen MacLeod
Queuekeeper of DoS
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From: joaknshld@aol.com (J Oaknshld)
Date: 22 Jan 1998 12:18:06 EST
Heh...I fear Luthy's blade.
Ya take it ta a grindstone every night Luthy? It's damn sharp, watchout Dueler ;)
~J
Date: 22 Jan 1998 12:18:06 EST
Heh...I fear Luthy's blade.
Ya take it ta a grindstone every night Luthy? It's damn sharp, watchout Dueler ;)
~J
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From: skylerjc@aol.com (Skyler JC)
Date: 22 Jan 1998 13:08:26 EST
>>I cannot help but ask the question... What have you done to put yourself to the higher position where you feel obligated to test me. <<
::wonders if there should be a question mark in that statement::
::shrugs:: Someone's gotta do it. And it's better that that someone be a nameless one, rather than someone with a reputation to lose. I'm just glad I'm not the one who has to do it. That Luthien chick is not a bad dueler...
~Skyler
Date: 22 Jan 1998 13:08:26 EST
>>I cannot help but ask the question... What have you done to put yourself to the higher position where you feel obligated to test me. <<
::wonders if there should be a question mark in that statement::
::shrugs:: Someone's gotta do it. And it's better that that someone be a nameless one, rather than someone with a reputation to lose. I'm just glad I'm not the one who has to do it. That Luthien chick is not a bad dueler...
~Skyler
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From: dueier@aol.com (DueIer)
Date: 22 Jan 1998 15:51:39 EST
Luthien, and the rest of the community,
Who made me the "distributor of tests" you say? No one. Is there neccessity for someone to tell you to do something when you wish it to be done? No.
<<How oft have you seen me defeated in the rings[?]>>
I must say I do not watch other people in the arena very often. I do not remember any match in particular, nor do I have a general memory of seeing you lose.
<<I've gone months witout[sic] challenge, but I've not gone months without dueling>>
Very true. But is it not a point of contention with many that a challenge match is in no way similar to a regular match? I certainly believe it is not.
<< >>It better helps me to understand this community, and in the process understand myself better as well.<<
As for the above quote... please spare us this patronization. You've challenged me, I accept that. No need to sugar coat it 'lest it begin to leave an offensive aftertaste.>>
Should you think this is an attempt at patronization, you might be right. However, I really do feel like learning this community better, and I do not lack the courage to state that I wish to do so. I have no wish to feel superior to you, but I merely am trying to point out what I believe is right, and what you believe may be wrong. If you think this is patronizing, so be it.
It is only due to public outcry against myself and Rand Al-Thor that I put pen to paper to make known my opinions. I did not wish this to be a match on message board paper, but if you, your husband, and the rest of the community wish to argue with me, I could care less. It will not effect the outcome of the match, although it may effect how I am treated, whether I receive additional challenges, and so on.
An offensive aftertaste may actually suit me, although I must say I certainly would like it to not happen as opposed to it happening. We do not know exactly what life will give us, but we must try the best to prepare ourselves for it. I certainly hope I am not hated in this community, but I am prepared to have that happen. We all must wait to see how it will unfold.
Thank you all again for reading my comments. You all know where to reach me.
~The Nameless DueIer~
aka "DueIer" et al
Date: 22 Jan 1998 15:51:39 EST
Luthien, and the rest of the community,
Who made me the "distributor of tests" you say? No one. Is there neccessity for someone to tell you to do something when you wish it to be done? No.
<<How oft have you seen me defeated in the rings[?]>>
I must say I do not watch other people in the arena very often. I do not remember any match in particular, nor do I have a general memory of seeing you lose.
<<I've gone months witout[sic] challenge, but I've not gone months without dueling>>
Very true. But is it not a point of contention with many that a challenge match is in no way similar to a regular match? I certainly believe it is not.
<< >>It better helps me to understand this community, and in the process understand myself better as well.<<
As for the above quote... please spare us this patronization. You've challenged me, I accept that. No need to sugar coat it 'lest it begin to leave an offensive aftertaste.>>
Should you think this is an attempt at patronization, you might be right. However, I really do feel like learning this community better, and I do not lack the courage to state that I wish to do so. I have no wish to feel superior to you, but I merely am trying to point out what I believe is right, and what you believe may be wrong. If you think this is patronizing, so be it.
It is only due to public outcry against myself and Rand Al-Thor that I put pen to paper to make known my opinions. I did not wish this to be a match on message board paper, but if you, your husband, and the rest of the community wish to argue with me, I could care less. It will not effect the outcome of the match, although it may effect how I am treated, whether I receive additional challenges, and so on.
An offensive aftertaste may actually suit me, although I must say I certainly would like it to not happen as opposed to it happening. We do not know exactly what life will give us, but we must try the best to prepare ourselves for it. I certainly hope I am not hated in this community, but I am prepared to have that happen. We all must wait to see how it will unfold.
Thank you all again for reading my comments. You all know where to reach me.
~The Nameless DueIer~
aka "DueIer" et al
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From: dakich@aol.com (Dakich)
Date: 23 Jan 1998 01:15:57 EST
:D
see the big happy face?
Feel better now?
-Dak
Date: 23 Jan 1998 01:15:57 EST
:D
see the big happy face?
Feel better now?
-Dak
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Date: 23 Jan 1998 11:17:36 EST
Nameless Dueler,
Here is an excerpt from your last post:
<<I did not wish this to be a match on message board paper, but if you, your husband, and the rest of the community wish to argue with me, I could care less. It will not effect the outcome of the match, although it may effect how I am treated, whether I receive additional challenges, and so on. >>
Perhaps I have misread this letter, and I do hope this to be the case; but it appears to me that you believe there is no hope of your defeat? Arrogance is not a sword to be wielded lightly, young sir... I suggest that you take the time to make everyone else believe you cannot lose before you start believing it yourself. Otherwise, you may incur the wrath of certain people who would seek to assure your loss and Luthien's victory. Yet, I suppose
humility is a valuable lesson that everyone must learn at some time in their lives (and that some need learn many times in their lives).
respectfully,
Lord Dalamar Ar'Daumon
Overlord of the Duel of Swords
Lord of the Dale
Guardian of the Oldest House
Nameless Dueler,
Here is an excerpt from your last post:
<<I did not wish this to be a match on message board paper, but if you, your husband, and the rest of the community wish to argue with me, I could care less. It will not effect the outcome of the match, although it may effect how I am treated, whether I receive additional challenges, and so on. >>
Perhaps I have misread this letter, and I do hope this to be the case; but it appears to me that you believe there is no hope of your defeat? Arrogance is not a sword to be wielded lightly, young sir... I suggest that you take the time to make everyone else believe you cannot lose before you start believing it yourself. Otherwise, you may incur the wrath of certain people who would seek to assure your loss and Luthien's victory. Yet, I suppose
humility is a valuable lesson that everyone must learn at some time in their lives (and that some need learn many times in their lives).
respectfully,
Lord Dalamar Ar'Daumon
Overlord of the Duel of Swords
Lord of the Dale
Guardian of the Oldest House