Quick to Act

[DoS Archive]

From: kalamere@aol.com (Kalamere)
Date: 29 May 1998 11:08:44 EDT

As I mentioned, there has been little consistency on this issue.

I can say with certainty that when I was Coord and when Devon was Coord, we ruled that the the change of title holder was not official until it was posted in the standings. That included the right to challenge, to be challenged and so forth... (fancies also)

It was my impression that Gloin and Feadur thought of it this way as well, but they are both long gone and I've no way to confirm that with them. As to the head manager of the Inn.... Well, I somehow doubt Kairee was terribly impartial when speaking with you Billy... no offense intended. It's possible that she even would have over-ruled the DoS Coord at the time, but in the reference to the match with you an I.... I wouldn't have accepted it as a
Baron's match unless I had been told before hand (which I was) that the official change in rank, had you won, (including fancies) wouldn't take place until the next standings and would not effect your duel with Iain... had there been one.

I won't speak for Helix. I attempted to make it clear before, but I'll try again now, I *think* that Helix interprets things the same way that Devon and I did. Whether or not she does I can't actually say.

~Kal...

[DoS Archive]

From: xstevegx@aol.com (X SteveG X)
Date: 29 May 1998 23:16:14 EDT

Early in my dueling career, I asked the Coordinators the very question that haunts the board. My understanding is that Barons (and OLs for that matter) are entitled to their rules on fancy maneuevers, but are not "officially" the holders until the results have been shown on the Standings. My understanding of this is that it is easily apparent to an official calling a match that a dueler is a Baron, while one must wait
to challenge until the public as a whole has been officially notified by the Standings Keeper (regardless of whether the caller posted it in public space or not).



-Steve

[DoS Archive]

From: prlunicorn@aol.com (PrlUnicorn)
Date: 30 May 1998 00:16:01 EDT

>>My understanding is that Barons (and OLs for that matter) are entitled to their rules on fancy maneuevers, but are not "officially" the holders until the results have been shown on the Standings. <<

On pondering this.. if the Barons "ARE" allowed this privelege then every other ranking should be granted the same. The only difference there is the Baron's rank is verifiable.


CAK

[DoS Archive]

From: baphelocl@aol.com (Bapheloc L)
Date: 30 May 1998 19:02:50 EDT

From my rememberence of History in the rings, You do not get the privledges of rank until they are posted in the current Standings. It states fairly clearly in the DoS Rules, that all ranks, titles, and privledges of rank and titles are retained until the next posting of the Standings. And it also states that no challenges can be made to someone until either thier new rank is posted in the Standings or the
completed results of the last challenge to that person has been posted in the Standings.



In summary, if it isn't posted in the Standings as the person's change of rank or current challenge able status, then you have to wait until such time as the Standings reflect that.




Honor to thyself,

Baphelocutis est Lathadoscia



::sealed in wax by the signet ring stamp of the royal family Lathadoscia::

[DoS Archive]

From: dukeuziei@aol.com (Duke UzieI)
Date: 31 May 1998 07:34:34 EDT

::finds it strange that he IS a Baron, but yet he is SO totally uninterested in this::

((Lemme try BOLD, NOT A POST))

[DoS Archive]

From: karnafexx@aol.com (Karnafexx)
Date: 31 May 1998 18:02:52 EDT

<< It states fairly clearly in the DoS Rules, that all ranks, titles, and privledges of rank and titles are retained until the next posting of the Standings.>>

If this is *true* then if I'm a baron and Baph beats me fer my ring then I'm still a baron till the next standings.....good deal, thanks Lizard-boy. ::Lopsided grin::


::Written in choppy red crayola::

Billy Ray
AKA: Karnafexx
"Simply the Best"

[DoS Archive]

From: girvin@aol.com (GIRVIN)
Date: 01 Jun 1998 11:14:17 EDT

Two things:



1) All challenges must run through the Standings Keeper and the DoS Supervisor *before* they are considered valid so really dragging up history is nice but there is a saving clause in the rules allowing the Supervisor to make any ruling not *specifically* addressed in the rules. In the case that brought this all up, *no* standings are official until the Standings are *posted.* You should be familiar with that, you know Warlords issuing challenges
before they are officially warlords? As I recall that little firestorm had the Barons all up for how to enforce respect, although I was not privilege to their meetings. It was one of the reasons the rule about invalid challenges being stripped of their right to challenge was made (they was they idea to strip peer wins and the right to challenge).



2) I think had Iain given Golden and Helix time to respond there might have been a different outcome than what may occur. According to the rule if the challenge is withdrawn *before* it is voided then the punishment occurs. I am not sure if Golden had a chance to do this.



Constant,

~Brian Girvin

just a dueler

[DoS Archive]

From: jonalyn@aol.com (Jonalyn)
Date: 01 Jun 1998 19:12:38 EDT

Gentles.

In perusing the rules of engagement, I cannot find a clause stating that challenges must pass before the eyes of the Dueling Supervisor.

To whit: "All challenges and answers to challenges must be sent to both the Standings Keeper and Baron or Overlord being challenged for purposes of notification and validation."

The rules of engagement are quite clear in that the penalty and only the penalty is withheld in the case of an improperly presented challenge.

To whit: "Challenges, if not properly served, will be voided by the Standings Keeper. In the case of a voided challenge, the challenger will have his or her right to challenge stripped for the remainder of the cycle as penalty. This penalty will *not* take effect if the challenge is withdrawn before voided."

I recall oft that Gloinikins, Feadur and Devon wouldst announce upon this ancient corkboard the validity or nae of challenges for the edification of the community.

Jona,
Common as they come.

[DoS Archive]

From: quickvarmg@aol.com (QuickVarMG)
Date: 02 Jun 1998 00:40:25 EDT

Good point, Lady Jona... but, it still brings me to wonder about the circumstances between Jeff's and K'yorl's challenge. I can only judge from what I read in the postings, but I thought Golden ruled the challenge invalid, first. Now, it seems the challenge is going on.

I guess this may not seem to be like my business, but when it comes down to challenges, I think this is everyone's business as to what circumstance allowed K'yorl to challenge when it was already stated as invalid?

±


"Words are spoken from the heart... the movement of blade is spoken from the mind."

[DoS Archive]

From: joaknshld@aol.com (J Oaknshld)
Date: 02 Jun 1998 01:02:50 EDT

Answer ta Var,

Golden ruled da last two peers wins invalid, he also told K'yorl he'd have ta wait da week. Reason he could rechallenge? K'yorl's first challenge was before da WL tourney and new rules, nothin' in da old rules stated PWs had ta be a week old and so no penalty was issued. Golden's policy has changed and in da future challenges with invalid peer wins will be tossed out along with da 8 valid PWs.

~J

[DoS Archive]

From: quickvarmg@aol.com (QuickVarMG)
Date: 02 Jun 1998 06:27:46 EDT

Thank you Jeff for clearing that up. I, for one, am not confused. If I have shown any disrespect regarding my questioning, I sincerely apologize now.

±


"Words are spoken from the heart... the movement of blade is spoken from the mind."

[DoS Archive]

From: jonalyn@aol.com (Jonalyn)
Date: 03 Jun 1998 18:01:10 EDT

To the Baron Jeffrey Oakenshield and M'lord Var Medici-Giovanni, Warlords and the Community at Large.

Gentles.

Oft in conflicts, battles large and small, the rules of engagement alter, as they must. However, the rules of engagement in this instance have nae altered.

To whit: "Standings will be posted approximately every week. Rankings and fancy maneuvers are retained until new standings are posted."

One needs but peruse M'lord Golden Evermeadow's New Policy announced upon this ancient corkboard and presented to the community upon the ninth day of the second moon, current C.E.D. (Current Era of DoS) for clarification of this issue prior to the issuance of the new rules of engagement,

To whit: <<Effective immediately, any challenge issued to a Baron or the Overlord that contains one or more peer wins that have not yet been posted on the Duel of Swords standings board will be struck down as invalid. For example: A Warlord has eight peer wins on Friday evening. That night, s/he garners two more in the duels, and then proceeds to challenge a Baron using those ten peer wins on the following Sunday. Since the standings are updated
on Thursdays, the last two peer wins are not yet legitimate peer wins. Thus, his/her challenge would be denied.
Unless I'm mistaken, this was Devon's, the former standings keeper, unwritten policy. I did not adopt that policy when I took the reigns, but I am now. It is being written and posted so there will be no controversy should this situation arise in the future. The main two reasons are fairness and accommodation to the standings keeper. Fairness belongs to other Warlords that may wish to challenge the same Baron or the Overlord and have ten or
fifteen legitimate peer wins, but do not get their chance due to another Warlord challenging with ten or fifteen peer wins with one or more not being legitimate. Accommodation to the standings keeper helps me validate challenges in a timely manner without having to wait for the week's reports to come in.
Should a Warlord challenge using one or more invalid peer wins like those just described and I am unable to validate that challenge until after the standings have been released, said challenge will still be struck down for the same reasons. Hopefully I shall be able to check all challenges within a few days so this situation never arises, but sometimes that may not be possible.
This policy does not affect any current challenges, whether or not they have been verified. Should my successor wish to handle this issue in a different matter, that will be his/her decision. One other note: Currently there is no penalty for issuing a challenge that is discovered to be invalid. When the revisions of the rules are released, however, there may indeed be a penalty. Submitting a challenge with invalid peer wins in the matter
described above may very well be grounds for a similar penalization. That will be determined by the time the revisions are printed. Any questions or comments may be left in my mailbox in the arena.

Goldendust Evermeadow
Standings Keeper
RDI Duel of Swords>>

Perhaps it would behoove all, from the lowliest of commoners who dreams of one day presenting a challenge to the most skillful of warlords who deem themselves worthy to present challenge, to study the rules of engagement.

One can but hope that, in the swiftness of their rise in rank to that of warlord, those warlords who deem themselves worthy to challenge, would pause in their rush to glory, to extend the barest of courtesies; that of issuing a proper challenge, per the very rules of engagement which permitted them to attain the rank with which to do so.

M'Lord Medici-Giovanni, indeed, we are in agreement upon the matter that the community should be apprised of circumstances.

I shall go even further in stating I stand proudly as a member of what is oft termed the old school in this regard. In my opinion, garnered over the many years I have both dueled and observed the glory that is the duels, whether the combatants are the best of friends or the deadliest of enemies, a modicrum of courtesy and respect for at least the title if not the one who holds the title of Baron or Overlord should be forthcoming from a challenger.
Insults may fly, grating upon some, disregarded by others, and in many cases the community at large is completely unaware the conflict, yet to insult the title by issuance of premature challenge, in my humble opinion, cast insult upon ALL who have ever and shall ever dance upon the sands of the rings.

Jona.
Common as they come.

The commoner mutters as she tacks the missive to the corkboard, "Och, bes' git th' umbrellas restocked, Hubie." Darts a way in full flight, hoping to avoid a bucket of water.

[DoS Archive]

From: lrdevasion@aol.com (LrdEvasion)
Date: 14 Jun 1998 10:51:33 EDT

Steve, Last cycle I dueled about 45 peer duels, and I won, get this, 12 of them. I still maintain my good health and all that happy go lucky stuff, In fact, your percentage as a warlord is mighty good... think about it... 46%...thats about one win outta every two, I am at 47 percent right now myself... Its all in your head.

-If you go into a battle giving it your all and knowing that you will win, you've already won half the battle.

~~Lord Tom Evasion~~
~~Warlord of the DoS~~