A New House Rises

[DoS Archive]

From: sidarthae@aol.com (Sidartha E)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 19:16:49 EDT

>>Sid, would friendship, fairplay and such --be-- an in quote "or else"? Basically... if there is friendship, and there is sportsmanship, and the is etc. There is no "or else". I'd also like to ask you Sid, define your term of "or else" You think we're gunna go and hurt people like Lupton or something?<<

Tom~

I don't know what you'd do, and I'd rather not wait and see.

Let me ask you a question. Say a Challenger comes along who is a complete idiot. Let's make an example that everyone who knew him would agree on: Guild God, or perhaps even his toady, Hyper Frisk.

Would House Rising oppose the Testing of such an idiot as Guild God or Hyper Frisk, even if it meant that by some strange twist of Fate, they might actually become our revered Overlord? Would House Rising interceed on their behalf?


~Sidartha Elgarette~
Swordslady (again)
All-Star, TDL
Captain, Dracoern Highlands
Duchess of the Eastern Duchy
New Mountainside

[DoS Archive]

From: lrdevasion@aol.com (LrdEvasion)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 19:24:22 EDT

Sid, I am not hiding behind Perci, but I do believe you should re-direct hat question to him. He is our spokesman.
~Tom

[DoS Archive]

From: sidarthae@aol.com (Sidartha E)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 19:36:14 EDT

>>Sid, I am not hiding behind Perci, but I do believe you should re-direct hat question to him. He is our spokesman.<<

Alright, I will...

Percival Marchand de Clermont....what is your reply?

~Sidartha Elgarette~
Swordslady (again)
All-Star, TDL
Captain, Dracoern Highlands
Duchess of the Eastern Duchy
New Mountainside

[DoS Archive]

From: lrdevasion@aol.com (LrdEvasion)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 19:47:44 EDT

Thank'ye for redirectin' it Sid :-)

~Tom

[DoS Archive]

From: tsycalsol@aol.com (Tsycal Sol)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 20:01:50 EDT

hi i am tsycal sol and i would like to join a new House Rises.I will be a good alli and a loyol supject.

please consider this notice please

[DoS Archive]

From: baphelocl@aol.com (Bapheloc L)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 20:06:04 EDT

m'lady Sidartha,

If your afraid of the trueth about the topic of which Kalamere has brought up then you shouldn't waste your time being involved in anything of this dueling community.

m'lords of House Rising,

Luck in your endevors. I see in many regards we share some of the same views and ideals, but not entirely. You have painted thyself's a huge target upon ye, much as I have. My advice would be walkly quickly and never on the same road.



Honor to thyself, Respect to others,

Baphelocutis est Lathadoscia



::sealed in wax by the signet ring stamp of the royal family Lathadoscia::

[DoS Archive]

From: quickvarmg@aol.com (QuickVarMG)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 20:16:35 EDT

As written by Tom:

>Lupton and Others,
We are here to --help-- the Duel of Swords. In no way are we a threat to the DoS. Nor are we demanding anything... did attacking so many poeple, Lupton... finally blind your vision?

Same to you G, we are here to help, not to hurt. I thought you to be smarter than that.<

Essentially, I think this to be an attack by a member of the house. Lord Percival, if you do not want people to attack on these boards, may I suggest an example be set by your own house?

Now, regarding why you oppose the test of worthiness. Does this apply for barony, as well? Overlord excercises his right to defend a loyal or neutral baron, and you step in? How about this as an example:
Dueling: In duels, people cut, slice, chop, hack, and cause injure to their opponent. Yes, the ward of Gondar heals the wound, but isn't allowing one to rechallenge if they fail the test preserving the essence of dueling?
People handle their duels and challenges differently. I tap my opponents, while others cut. Some test, some don't. It's how people handle their situation. Forming a house saying we will oppose all who don't practice what we WANT in a challenge is, in my opinion, unsportsmanlike. That's your choice, but I honestly think a little more thought is required.
I'm not saying cutting people during a duel is wrong. It's called an analogy, just as G'nort's was, regarding the war.
A suggestion: if you truly want a change in the rules, you write to Lady Helix, the coordinator, as Summer did. You can also have Zen, Evan, Avery (or any other supporting barons) address the subject to the baron's council. There are many ways you can handle this situation, and in my opinion, the most extreme was taken first.

>Above all, do NOT sink to their level. Two wrongs do not make a right. Instead, a good example should be shown, the challenger defeated, and things gotten on with.<
I'm sorry to say, Percival, but these words aren't agreeing with your policy. If it is so wrong to have someone step in for the champion, then it is equally wrong to have the challenger get someone to fight for him. The challenger should set an example as much as the champion should, since if the challenger wins, he's now the champion. Also, if the challenger insults, mocks, or just slanders the champion, would you do the same, to defend
the champion? Mocking is unsportsmanlike, right?
Evan has also excercised his right to challenge Dal because Dal changed his alignment. Now, if I were to have a strict policy, as your house does (not meaning to attack), I would consider THIS unsportsmanlike. Dal in no way is taking the baronial rank away from him, but Evan is trying to take away Dal's overlord rank, because his alignment was changed. As I said before, please follow the examples you wish to set.
While you may take whatever measures necessary to defend those challengers, I suggest you look at the WHOLE picture of DoS. There are more policies than the test.
A quote, which I believe has been used more than once, "Just because it is one's right, does not make it right".


Simply,

Var Medici-Giovanni

±

|¯Proud to put his family first¯|

|¯Unwavered loyalty to Dalamar¯|

|¯Holder of the 10th baronial ring¯|

|¯Attempting to defend what's right¯|

[DoS Archive]

From: leducblanc@aol.com (LeDucBlanc)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 20:19:46 EDT

My reply is very simple. We would oppose his Testing. Then, if he won, we would oppose him. We would not let an idiot or tyrant sit on the seat for long.
However, if he earned the right to duel for that seat, in the name of sportsmanship and fair play it would be wrong NOT to let HIM duel for it against the Overlord.



The White Duke

[DoS Archive]

From: leducblanc@aol.com (LeDucBlanc)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 20:21:33 EDT

Warlord G'nort,

You have the right to disagree with us. That you respect our opinion is enough.




The White Duke

[DoS Archive]

From: sidarthae@aol.com (Sidartha E)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 20:25:10 EDT

>>m'lady Sidartha,

If your afraid of the trueth about the topic of which Kalamere has brought up then you shouldn't waste your time being involved in anything of this dueling community.<<

Baphe~

I'm not afraid of it. I'm not telling him to stop talking about it, just telling him that he's beating a dead horse.


~Sidartha Elgarette~
Swordslady (again)
All-Star, TDL
Captain, Dracoern Highlands
Duchess of the Eastern Duchy
New Mountainside

[DoS Archive]

From: sidarthae@aol.com (Sidartha E)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 20:29:20 EDT

>>My reply is very simple. We would oppose his Testing. Then, if he won, we would oppose him. We would not let an idiot or tyrant sit on the seat for long.<<

It is for exactly this reason that I oppose your House. Rather than stopping the problem before it starts, you want to wait until the problem arises, and then do something about it, when it may very well be too late. That is where you are dead wrong.


~Sidartha Elgarette~
Swordslady (again)
All-Star, TDL
Captain, Dracoern Highlands
Duchess of the Eastern Duchy
New Mountainside

[DoS Archive]

From: leducblanc@aol.com (LeDucBlanc)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 20:31:02 EDT

" I'm sorry to say, Percival, but these words aren't agreeing with your policy. If it is so wrong to have someone step in for the champion, then it is equally wrong to have the challenger get someone to fight for him. The challenger should set an example as much as the champion should, since if the challenger wins, he's now the champion. Also, if the challenger insults, mocks, or just slanders the
champion, would you do the same, to defend
the champion? Mocking is unsportsmanlike, right"

I have seen this argument advanced repeatedly by many people. It is specious. It assumes that there is something wrong in evening unfair odds. Is there something wrong in aiding someone unfairly beset? If you were attacked by two men instead of one, would you want me to draw my blade and aid you or stand by and watch?



The White Duke

[DoS Archive]

From: lrdevasion@aol.com (LrdEvasion)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 20:45:35 EDT

Var, as for what I said earlier, I wish to apologize. Me, as in myself and not the House Rising, wrote that. That was my view, and none other... don't criticize the house for my actions.


~Tom

[DoS Archive]

From: leducblanc@aol.com (LeDucBlanc)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 21:04:44 EDT

Lady Sidartha,

I have only one thing to say. Two wrongs do not make a right. To not meet an opponent with honor is unsportsmanlike even if your opponent has no honor. It is wrong to sink to their level.




The White Duke

[DoS Archive]

From: waikrboh@aol.com (WaIkrBoh)
Date: 09 Aug 1998 21:05:11 EDT

Why are we trying to convince people of something when their minds are already made up?

So far, I have heard from the House: No Tests.
From many, and the opinion I share: Test only "street trash"
Some, like Dal appears to, seem to think: Test all but a few highly recognized duelers.

No one is ever saying, however: Test everyone.

Not surprising though.

That makes 3 opinions, but the main two that seem to be at issue are the first two. And why not? The third is merely extending the second. The way I see it is much like Sid, if you (general use, not targeted at anyone or group) think a trashy dueler is challenging for Overlord, then test him. Why wait until after? Have the dueler prove himself before letting him "through the floodgates" to the Overlord.

However, if you (general) believe that the test is unsportsmanlike against even street trash, and would rather go through the longer and more painful way to keeping him off the throne, I really can't say much to refute you. That's what you think, and it hurts you more than me.

The question we *really* should be asking ourselves, is what are they going to do know that they've "come out of the closet". For instance, I do not see Zen quickly jumping out of his Loyal alignment as others have brought up, yet is a member of a house that opposes the Overlord's use of the test. To me, this makes the entire house at this moment a farce. If a titlted member cannot even stand with the group against the issues they stand for, what
use is the house? You may support this, and not support that, but where does this get you?

What really makes the largest impression in my mind of new groups are their actions and how they relate to their beliefs. So far this group has taken no action, and their is ample evidence to show that they should have. As for me, I'll just wait it out and see what they intend for the future before coming to a long-term view of the group. So far their pattern of behavior tells me there is little to worry about.

Thank you reading this far,

-Walker Boh

Grand Master of DoS

Mage of DoM

Emerald of DoF